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ucan'tlickourcocks 04-25-2014 01:01 AM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by henmania (Post 4142887)
We probably devote less time to ST in practice than any other top 25 school. SOS has always done that. Plus we don't put many starters on ST. Lots of schools do. SOS doesn't believe in that. I think that has as much to do with results.

A lot of that may be true, but also consider it seems every year SOS gets peeved by the ST, and swears he is going to emphasize ST more, get more talent on ST...... then nothing seems to change.

We can argue about tactics, but hard to argue about the success we have had the last three years..... add if we can win the games we are favored to win next year, and one one or two we may not be favored..... could be a special year...... 4th place finish will be hard to match or beat!

Flameout12 04-25-2014 10:07 AM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ucan'tlickourcocks (Post 4143131)
...then nothing seems to change.!

They have changed it around...but every year is different. We've had a lot of starters on STs in the past...I think Jadeveon was on one of them last year and pretty sure Devin Taylor used to be on some of them as well as MI6. Stephon Gilmore used to do STs as well as some of our starting LBs and DBs.
Losing Ace was a killer...we struggle with lack of dynamic return men and punters more than anything. Ace showed what a dynamic return man could do and Spencer Lanning and Ryan Succop were good punters for us.

MWard 04-25-2014 10:44 AM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Flameout12 (Post 4143206)
Ace showed what a dynamic return man could do and Spencer Lanning and Ryan Succop were good punters for us.

Yep, we had it good for a while. It's easy to take a solid punter for granted until you don't have one.

poppabeary3 04-25-2014 11:10 AM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by yazoo (Post 4142899)
That might be true if he were telling the truth. Instead, he is whining and lacks a factual foundation to support his argument our ST were "horrible." We actually were low in many of the ST statistical categories, but we were at least mediocre in several, including the important kickoff category, and we were outstanding in the FG statistics. The statistics prove the claim we were "horrible" is false and the dude who made the allegation should be called out on it.

Also, I find it ironic that since Robinson is the coach credited with finding and bringing in Fry, I think we are resistant to giving him a chance before we the fans call his teams "horrible." That is not true and it is not fact. It is an exaggerated whiney opinion, which by all means please post it publicly on our fan site, and let others support the person who wants to make it.

Moreover, I like the quirky direction our kicking game is headed. Watch the movie the Replacements and learn that kickers are weird. I don't think it hurts us to have a weird, quirky coach involved in our ST. It is likely good for the team overall and probably contributed to our high ranking.

I dont even know where to begin with this post...

Big-Cock 04-25-2014 11:41 AM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by yazoo (Post 4142899)
That might be true if he were telling the truth. Instead, he is whining and lacks a factual foundation to support his argument our ST were "horrible." We actually were low in many of the ST statistical categories, but we were at least mediocre in several, including the important kickoff category, and we were outstanding in the FG statistics. The statistics prove the claim we were "horrible" is false and the dude who made the allegation should be called out on it.

Also, I find it ironic that since Robinson is the coach credited with finding and bringing in Fry, I think we are resistant to giving him a chance before we the fans call his teams "horrible." That is not true and it is not fact. It is an exaggerated whiney opinion, which by all means please post it publicly on our fan site, and let others support the person who wants to make it.

Moreover, I like the quirky direction our kicking game is headed. Watch the movie the Replacements and learn that kickers are weird. I don't think it hurts us to have a weird, quirky coach involved in our ST. It is likely good for the team overall and probably contributed to our high ranking.

Whining?? Factual this buddy.

We finished ranked as follows:

#55 Kicking
#93 Returning
#117 Punting

http://espn.go.com/college-football/...fieldGoalsMade http://espn.go.com/college-football/...stat/returning http://espn.go.com/college-football/..._/stat/punting

Why don't you do some research first before trying to call someone out. Those rankings look pretty "horrible" to me. If I performed like that at work I would be fired.

trapper82 04-25-2014 11:47 AM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by yazoo (Post 4142899)
That might be true if he were telling the truth. Instead, he is whining and lacks a factual foundation to support his argument our ST were "horrible." We actually were low in many of the ST statistical categories, but we were at least mediocre in several, including the important kickoff category, and we were outstanding in the FG statistics. The statistics prove the claim we were "horrible" is false and the dude who made the allegation should be called out on it.

Also, I find it ironic that since Robinson is the coach credited with finding and bringing in Fry, I think we are resistant to giving him a chance before we the fans call his teams "horrible." That is not true and it is not fact. It is an exaggerated whiney opinion, which by all means please post it publicly on our fan site, and let others support the person who wants to make it.

Moreover, I like the quirky direction our kicking game is headed. Watch the movie the Replacements and learn that kickers are weird. I don't think it hurts us to have a weird, quirky coach involved in our ST. It is likely good for the team overall and probably contributed to our high ranking.

Sorry, I just cannot agree and posted as such awhile back:

http://www.cockytalk.com/showthread....+teams+improve

Look no further than Auburn to see that special teams can cost you championships. They missed a field goal, allowed a return for a TD and missed a fake punt on a 4th down that basically turned the momentum around in that championship game.

I fear the same will be true for our team if we don't do something different this year, and so far I have heard nothing that we are doing to make it better.

1. We ranked dead last in punting and punt returns in the SEC for the year.
2. We ranked 10th in kickoff returns in the SEC for the year.
3. In 2012 we ranked 12th in punting and 13th in returns.
4. In 2011 it was 11th in punting and 10th in returns. (with 12 SEC teams)
5. In 2010, the one year we went to the SEC championship game, we were 6th in punting and 8th in returns.

I am not saying we need to be first in these categories at the expense of others, but ranking last and expecting good results is a recipe for disaster. The field position game is extremely important on the road where your offense can stall and crowd noise can effect your offensive efficiency. Anyone notice that we are a very different team on the road? The one year we had average statistics for the conference in these areas happened to be the one year we ended up in the championship game. Now I am not saying that having decent punt and return units put you in championship games, what I am saying is you can't be dead last or right at it year after year with good results. Sooner or later it will bite you, and you will lose a close game that you should win because the other team focuses on it more than you. (Tennesee in 2013?)

Fast forward to 2014, we are losing Ellington and Hampton, and frankly we haven't heard a single thing even addressing how subpar this performance is. It would be one thing if it was talked about and acknowledged it needed improving but I haven't seen anything yet? Am I missing something?

Big-Cock 04-25-2014 11:55 AM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by trapper82 (Post 4143283)
Sorry, I just cannot agree and posted as such awhile back:

http://www.cockytalk.com/showthread....+teams+improve

Look no further than Auburn to see that special teams can cost you championships. They missed a field goal, allowed a return for a TD and missed a fake punt on a 4th down that basically turned the momentum around in that championship game.

I fear the same will be true for our team if we don't do something different this year, and so far I have heard nothing that we are doing to make it better.

1. We ranked dead last in punting and punt returns in the SEC for the year.
2. We ranked 10th in kickoff returns in the SEC for the year.
3. In 2012 we ranked 12th in punting and 13th in returns.
4. In 2011 it was 11th in punting and 10th in returns. (with 12 SEC teams)
5. In 2010, the one year we went to the SEC championship game, we were 6th in punting and 8th in returns.

I am not saying we need to be first in these categories at the expense of others, but ranking last and expecting good results is a recipe for disaster. The field position game is extremely important on the road where your offense can stall and crowd noise can effect your offensive efficiency. Anyone notice that we are a very different team on the road? The one year we had average statistics for the conference in these areas happened to be the one year we ended up in the championship game. Now I am not saying that having decent punt and return units put you in championship games, what I am saying is you can't be dead last or right at it year after year with good results. Sooner or later it will bite you, and you will lose a close game that you should win because the other team focuses on it more than you. (Tennesee in 2013?)

Fast forward to 2014, we are losing Ellington and Hampton, and frankly we haven't heard a single thing even addressing how subpar this performance is. It would be one thing if it was talked about and acknowledged it needed improving but I haven't seen anything yet? Am I missing something?

This is why I think there is more to it then him just not coaching TEs anymore.

trapper82 04-25-2014 11:59 AM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by poppabeary3 (Post 4143254)
I dont even know where to begin with this post...

Well, I thought about starting with the reference to the Replacements, whose kicker is a converted soccer guy who smokes on the bench and tries to throw the game because of gambling debts, but decided to stick with the actual football related things.

trapper82 04-25-2014 12:00 PM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
My brother made another good point, we have TE's that have arguably underachieved from a consistency standpoint, especially last year. You'd have some good performances, some bad. But maybe having the guy who coaches QB's coach the TE's is just a better idea overall. They can be on the same page more, which would arguably lead to more success for that unit. Anderson, Adams and Owens are three good options, not counting the freshmen.

bobbycock 04-25-2014 12:04 PM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by trapper82 (Post 4143287)
Well, I thought about starting with the reference to the Replacements, whose kicker is a converted soccer guy who smokes on the bench and tries to throw the game because of gambling debts, but decided to stick with the actual football related things.

our kicker is wiry.

Mt. Lattimore 04-25-2014 01:05 PM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
All I know is that Spurrier has sent some good ones to the NFL.

Justice
Weslye
Jared

GregoryHouse 04-25-2014 01:20 PM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
Quote:

Losing Ace was a killer...we struggle with lack of dynamic return men and punters more than anything. Ace showed what a dynamic return man could do and Spencer Lanning and Ryan Succop were good punters for us.
We have trouble covering returns too

Flameout12 04-25-2014 01:36 PM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bobbycock (Post 4143291)
our kicker is wiry.

Wiry fry?

Lonnie 04-25-2014 02:36 PM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by GH (Post 4143331)
We have trouble covering returns too

This times 1000x.


yazoo 04-25-2014 02:36 PM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Big-Cock (Post 4143279)
Whining?? Factual this buddy.

We finished ranked as follows:

#55 Kicking
#93 Returning
#117 Punting

http://espn.go.com/college-football/...fieldGoalsMade http://espn.go.com/college-football/...stat/returning http://espn.go.com/college-football/..._/stat/punting

Why don't you do some research first before trying to call someone out. Those rankings look pretty "horrible" to me. If I performed like that at work I would be fired.

Meh. The SEC stats is what you should be looking at. NCAA stats don't measure fairly because you are measuring our team against other teams that play weaker schedules.

Our ST statistics are poor. Our players were not "horrible." That constitutes lying.

I watched the games and could see that they were inadequate. But even when you look at the worst of the statistical categories, we are not way below the rest of the league, which is what "horrible" means to a normal person. If you want to redefine "horrible" to something else, that may be your problem.

Nobody seems to be rebutting my argument that Robinson is a quirky guy that fits well into our staff. You cannot fill a staff up with high intensity people like Elliott and Whammy. You need some balance. I like what Spurrier is doing here from a social perspective. I would like to know how our players feel about Robinson. Do they like him, think he is a dufus, or what? I suspect the love him.

I watched the spring game and our team, like Ray's baseball team, have a lot of happy go lucky goofy people. We are loose, and that is a good thing in football. We could be playing uptight like the Gators.

trapper82 04-25-2014 02:40 PM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by yazoo (Post 4143373)
Meh. The SEC stats is what you should be looking at. NCAA stats don't measure fairly because you are measuring our team against other teams that play weaker schedules.

Our ST statistics are poor. Our players were not "horrible." That constitutes lying.

I watched the games and could see that they were inadequate. But even when you look at the worst of the statistical categories, we are not way below the rest of the league, which is what "horrible" means to a normal person. If you want to redefine "horrible" to something else, that may be your problem.

Well, I posted about our SEC stats. In the SEC, we are doing very badly, toward the bottom. For someone to indicate that is horrible, given the level of talent we have on the special teams unit should outdo some of those opponents we are going against is not all that crazy.

Goofyboy 04-25-2014 03:11 PM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
My hope is that the TE's start hanging out with the QB's and they start getting targeted more. I think Mangus has a lot of influence on the QB progressions and tendencies. As far as the TE's under-performing, I believe that is mostly a matter of not being thrown-to. Often they have to make tough catches in traffic, but I only recall a few drops, and you will have those even on wide-open situations not anticipating a hit. I see excellent traits in all four scholarship TE's. Adams has outstanding height and speed (around 4.55), good hands, and is getting some bulk. He can jump. Busta has good height and speed (around 4.6), good hands, and good elusiveness/vision. Owens has outstanding height, pretty good hands, below-average speed. Rainey has near average height, good speed (around 4.6), and can jump. He seems to be getting near the best weight for his frame and has worked hard at adapting to position changes. Each offers his own set of matchup problems. I honestly think if they are targeted more on short/int routes it will put safeties in a bind between helping cover fast WR's like Byrd and Shaq and TE's that are too quick or too tall for most linebackers to stay with. Adams has shown he can stretch the field, and Busta is very effective if not covered underneath with his elusiveness. This could be a year of several long TD's by TE's breaking a short one long or beating coverage deep. If they show up big early, the WR's could have a field day later.

Big-Cock 04-25-2014 03:33 PM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by yazoo (Post 4143373)
Meh. The SEC stats is what you should be looking at. NCAA stats don't measure fairly because you are measuring our team against other teams that play weaker schedules.

Our ST statistics are poor. Our players were not "horrible." That constitutes lying.

I watched the games and could see that they were inadequate. But even when you look at the worst of the statistical categories, we are not way below the rest of the league, which is what "horrible" means to a normal person. If you want to redefine "horrible" to something else, that may be your problem.

Nobody seems to be rebutting my argument that Robinson is a quirky guy that fits well into our staff. You cannot fill a staff up with high intensity people like Elliott and Whammy. You need some balance. I like what Spurrier is doing here from a social perspective. I would like to know how our players feel about Robinson. Do they like him, think he is a dufus, or what? I suspect the love him.

I watched the spring game and our team, like Ray's baseball team, have a lot of happy go lucky goofy people. We are loose, and that is a good thing in football. We could be playing uptight like the Gators.


I never said the players were horrible. I said that with all the talent on the team that ST shouldn't be as bad as they are. The speed and pure athleticism that our players have they should not be last in SEC or NCAA categories. This tells me it coaching and the schemes he runs. I don't need to redefine my words as even Ray Charles can see that the ST are plain out horrible.

Im sorry but it is not a lie if we are almost dead last in all categories of ST. If we finished near the bottom on offense and defense would you be saying that its just that the NCAA stats don't measure fairly?

trapper82 04-25-2014 03:39 PM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by yazoo (Post 4143373)
Nobody seems to be rebutting my argument that Robinson is a quirky guy that fits well into our staff. You cannot fill a staff up with high intensity people like Elliott and Whammy. You need some balance. I like what Spurrier is doing here from a social perspective. I would like to know how our players feel about Robinson. Do they like him, think he is a dufus, or what? I suspect the love him.

I watched the spring game and our team, like Ray's baseball team, have a lot of happy go lucky goofy people. We are loose, and that is a good thing in football. We could be playing uptight like the Gators.

I doubt anyone here, including yourself, really knows enough about each person's coaching style to say that he truly brings balance. What C2 has said numerous times in the recruiting world is that Robinson does not seem to be doing well in that arena right now. Couple it with sub-par TEAM performances in Special Teams and things really need to improve.

Acockolypse Now 04-25-2014 03:53 PM

Re: Mangus now coaching TEs
 
Alabama agrees that special teams can lose games.


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