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Thread: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

  1. #341
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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    Quote Originally Posted by pitchcock View Post
    Even if Walker and Murphy stayed committed or committed the gap is still widening on paper.
    That is the standard comment, based on this logic: If Clemson signs 20 4* or higher players, and South Carolina signs 10 4* or higher, then the gap is widening - Clemson has that many more 4* plus players.

    While true, it ignores the fact that the game is not played with a full roster of 85 players. Sure, you need reserves and redshirting a few guys to get them ready is a good idea. But if South Carolina gets 10 4* recruits and loses 5 4* recruits to graduation, then that is a net gain of 5 - and South Carolina's roster is stronger. Meanwhile, Clemson is replacing 4* (or higher) players with more of the same, which simply keeps them at the same high level.

    Take, for instance, their D Line - which is where the highly rated players on Defense are concentrated. Even with all of their 4* plus guys, will they be better this year? Without four high draft picks, who take beaucoups talent AND experience with them?

    How about South Carolina, who returns pretty much everyone on the D Line, plus gets back guys that were hurt last year, plus adds 4* plus guys like Pickens, Fitten and Anderson? And this year's D Line class could very well be even better.

    As good as Clemson's Offense has been, they did not take it to the next level until they upgraded their D, with their primary strength being on the line. We are quickly getting there as well - so the gap is narrowing.

  2. #342
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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    Ace, theoretically you are correct in any given recruiting year. But there is much more to it. Clemson has been stocking up on talent for a long time. They generally replace graduating players with equal or better and have been for a long time. You are also ignoring the number of highly rated 4* players and 5* stars they have and continue to get. Plus, you are not factoring in the coaching these players have been receiving. The staff at Clemson has proven they can develop high level players at almost every position. The SC staff has not done this so far.

    We cannot and will not catch Clemson by "out-recruiting" them. It just isn't going to happen. But we can (eventually) get enough talented players together to put together a good enough team to beat them in Columbia. It may happen this coming season. But we need to strike "gold" like Clemson did with Watson. Someone has to emerge as a star and he has to have a supporting cast. Under Spurrier it was a succession of stars at WR, running back, linebacker, DE, safety and QB. We just have not had enough guys perform at that level the past 4 years.

    My confidence in Champ's ability to grease that particular slide (create the circumstances where that can happen) is not very high. I think he has to prove he can get guys to play at a very high level THIS year and NEXT year. If he can't and we muddle around at 6-6 to 7-5 then the school has to make a decision. Is that good enough or do we want to achieve more. Do we really want to win championships?

  3. #343
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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    Quote Originally Posted by Wisercock View Post
    Ace, theoretically you are correct in any given recruiting year. But there is much more to it. Clemson has been stocking up on talent for a long time. They generally replace graduating players with equal or better and have been for a long time. You are also ignoring the number of highly rated 4* players and 5* stars they have and continue to get. Plus, you are not factoring in the coaching these players have been receiving. The staff at Clemson has proven they can develop high level players at almost every position. The SC staff has not done this so far.

    We cannot and will not catch Clemson by "out-recruiting" them. It just isn't going to happen. But we can (eventually) get enough talented players together to put together a good enough team to beat them in Columbia. It may happen this coming season. But we need to strike "gold" like Clemson did with Watson. Someone has to emerge as a star and he has to have a supporting cast. Under Spurrier it was a succession of stars at WR, running back, linebacker, DE, safety and QB. We just have not had enough guys perform at that level the past 4 years.

    My confidence in Champ's ability to grease that particular slide (create the circumstances where that can happen) is not very high. I think he has to prove he can get guys to play at a very high level THIS year and NEXT year. If he can't and we muddle around at 6-6 to 7-5 then the school has to make a decision. Is that good enough or do we want to achieve more. Do we really want to win championships?
    Clemson's program is further along than USC's. They have a lot of talent. But none of this is true haha. This is just some pessimistic beta - drivel. Coach Muschamp and the staff have proven that they can develop high level players at every position. I seriously cannot believe you can post such a false statement without melting away into nonexistence. So D.J. Wonnum just showed up on campus as an elite 5-star prospect and dominated on the edge from Day #1? I remember an unheralded recruit that showed promise in the rotation as a freshman, and has developed into the most versatile edge in the conference. Steven Montac took a lot of lumps last year, but that is a success story. Look at where he was when he arrived on campus and look at how much he developed. Hayden Hurst???? Pass me some of what you are smoking.


    And yes, we can "out-recruit" Clemson. We do it by bringing in better players than they are bringing in. That doesnt happen overnight. Their 5 highest profile recruits are going to be ranked higher than our 5 highest recruits for the next few years. But from 6-25 is very winnable.

    Look at this year's class. We got the best defensive line recruit in the conference. We got the best quarterback in the conference. THOSE ARE THE TWO MUST IMPORTANT POSITIONS. But people like you look at the computer generated rankings based on an average of the entire class's rating and cry because they are 10 and USC is 17. Get a grip dude. Ill take Hilinski over Taisun Phommachanh, and I'll take Pickens and Anderson over all of their 2019 DL. Andrew Booth is further along physically than Cam Smith, but Cam Smith could be better than Andrew Booth when they are both juniors.

    Our 2019 recruiting class is better than Clemson's 2019 recruiting class, so there's at least 1 year of out-recruiting them. PROVE ME WRONG.
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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    Quote Originally Posted by gamecox3 View Post
    Clemson's program is further along than USC's. They have a lot of talent. But none of this is true haha. This is just some pessimistic beta - drivel. Coach Muschamp and the staff have proven that they can develop high level players at every position. I seriously cannot believe you can post such a false statement without melting away into nonexistence. So D.J. Wonnum just showed up on campus as an elite 5-star prospect and dominated on the edge from Day #1? I remember an unheralded recruit that showed promise in the rotation as a freshman, and has developed into the most versatile edge in the conference. Steven Montac took a lot of lumps last year, but that is a success story. Look at where he was when he arrived on campus and look at how much he developed. Hayden Hurst???? Pass me some of what you are smoking.


    And yes, we can "out-recruit" Clemson. We do it by bringing in better players than they are bringing in. That doesnt happen overnight. Their 5 highest profile recruits are going to be ranked higher than our 5 highest recruits for the next few years. But from 6-25 is very winnable.

    Look at this year's class. We got the best defensive line recruit in the conference. We got the best quarterback in the conference. THOSE ARE THE TWO MUST IMPORTANT POSITIONS. But people like you look at the computer generated rankings based on an average of the entire class's rating and cry because they are 10 and USC is 17. Get a grip dude. Ill take Hilinski over Taisun Phommachanh, and I'll take Pickens and Anderson over all of their 2019 DL. Andrew Booth is further along physically than Cam Smith, but Cam Smith could be better than Andrew Booth when they are both juniors.

    Our 2019 recruiting class is better than Clemson's 2019 recruiting class, so there's at least 1 year of out-recruiting them. PROVE ME WRONG.
    Clemson has lost 2 games in the past 3 years and they have won 2 national championships by beating Alabama twice in the Championship game.

    DJ Wonnum is a good player but we need great players. Maybe Pickens and Hilinski will prove to be the ones to take us over the top, but I'm not confident enough (based on the past) to make that assessment. If they are that good I'll be the first one to applaud.

  5. #345
    2nd Team All-SEC CockTail's Avatar
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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    You don’t need an entire team of 5*s to compete with Clemson. You play about 30 player total on offense and defense. We need 30 really good players. Having 70 5*s doesn’t help you if you cant get them all on the field. See Feaster. Where that does help you is in practice and with having depth in case of injury. Clemson has become a factory in recruiting, we won’t catch them any time soon, but that doesn’t necessarily mean we cant compete with them on the field.
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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    Quote Originally Posted by CockTail View Post
    You don’t need an entire team of 5*s to compete with Clemson. You play about 30 player total on offense and defense. We need 30 really good players. Having 70 5*s doesn’t help you if you cant get them all on the field. See Feaster. Where that does help you is in practice and with having depth in case of injury. Clemson has become a factory in recruiting, we won’t catch them any time soon, but that doesn’t necessarily mean we cant compete with them on the field.

    In a vacuum I agree with that and that's why we won't get to their level based on recruiting rankings. Clemson got to where they are now by putting together a good team around a great QB. We can do the same.

    I have not seen Pickens or Hilinski play in a game yet. I'll reserve judgment on just how good they are until then.

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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    Quote Originally Posted by Wisercock View Post
    In a vacuum I agree with that and that's why we won't get to their level based on recruiting rankings. Clemson got to where they are now by putting together a good team around a great QB. We can do the same.

    I have not seen Pickens or Hilinski play in a game yet. I'll reserve judgment on just how good they are until then.
    Honestly, I think all this conversation about Clemson isn't doing us any favors. I'd love to beat the socks off Clemson everyday and then take a nice nap, but that won't happen anytime soon. What can happen though, is we focus on being a contender in the East again. We need to start focusing on winning the East and putting the Dawgs back outside again. Once we are able to do that, we're already in a much better place to play Clemson and likely win. I may be the minority here, but I would rather us have a successful season and win the East, than a mediocre season and beat Clemson. One looks like progress, the other looks like a fluke.
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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    Quote Originally Posted by gamecox3 View Post
    Clemson's program is further along than USC's. They have a lot of talent. But none of this is true haha. This is just some pessimistic beta - drivel. Coach Muschamp and the staff have proven that they can develop high level players at every position. I seriously cannot believe you can post such a false statement without melting away into nonexistence. So D.J. Wonnum just showed up on campus as an elite 5-star prospect and dominated on the edge from Day #1? I remember an unheralded recruit that showed promise in the rotation as a freshman, and has developed into the most versatile edge in the conference. Steven Montac took a lot of lumps last year, but that is a success story. Look at where he was when he arrived on campus and look at how much he developed. Hayden Hurst???? Pass me some of what you are smoking.


    And yes, we can "out-recruit" Clemson. We do it by bringing in better players than they are bringing in. That doesnt happen overnight. Their 5 highest profile recruits are going to be ranked higher than our 5 highest recruits for the next few years. But from 6-25 is very winnable.

    Look at this year's class. We got the best defensive line recruit in the conference. We got the best quarterback in the conference. THOSE ARE THE TWO MUST IMPORTANT POSITIONS. But people like you look at the computer generated rankings based on an average of the entire class's rating and cry because they are 10 and USC is 17. Get a grip dude. Ill take Hilinski over Taisun Phommachanh, and I'll take Pickens and Anderson over all of their 2019 DL. Andrew Booth is further along physically than Cam Smith, but Cam Smith could be better than Andrew Booth when they are both juniors.

    Our 2019 recruiting class is better than Clemson's 2019 recruiting class, so there's at least 1 year of out-recruiting them. PROVE ME WRONG.
    I love DJ Wonnum as a player. That said, he wouldn’t have started at Clemson last year or previously. Not 100% sure he’d start there this year.

    Steven Montac wouldn’t touch the field at Clemson.

    Hayden Hurst succeeded not only because he was a great athlete, but he pushed himself while a lot of our guys didn’t.

    Like I said, ON PAPER the gap is widening. They currently have 3 5* commits for DL. We’re praying we get one, while we’re losing out on DL prospects to UNC. They have quality depth at most positions, while we’re still in the situation of having one or two injuries at a position cause a bad domino effect. Doesn’t matter to me how many 5* QB’s they sign, barring injury only one will get substantial playing time. But when they’re stockpiling players that can switch in and out without a drop off in level of play, it makes them tougher to beat. It’s no different than UGA or Bama.

    They’ve been extraordinarily lucky as a program. They’ve had a very high “hit rate” for successful players, and by and large have avoided serious injuries.

    In contrast, we’ve had a lot of injuries, guys not quite pan out, guys at position of need transfer out, or guys just not qualify. They were happy to dump Josh Belk, while most of our fan base (including me) were happy to have him. Now a year later he’s left the program and driving a truck. We have to take more gambles right now, they don’t.

    I think Champ and his staff have done pretty much a miraculous job considering the hole they started in. If the fan base can remain patient (which based on posters here isn’t likely) I think he can turn the tide and slowly even things up.

    One thing Clemson has been able to do is secure highly rated commits early and hang on to them. On the other hand, we get a few highly rated commits, have interest from a few more highly rated guys, then have to sweat out whether we can keep them in the fold.

    What fixes that? Winning. Winning big. We somehow have to beat the odds against UGA and/or Bama, then take care of business against everyone else.

  9. #349
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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    We have guys arguing a program not being on par with another that's won 2 national titles in 3 years while said original program was a 3 win team at the start of that run. "Oh Clemson has 50 5* DL that could suit up for New England next week and we don't. We're never going to compete with them." How do you think Clemson got to a level to compete with Bama year in and year out? "Oh no, Bama just signed their bazillionth 5*, we're never going to be as good as they are. We should just pack it up and stop trying. What's the use?"

    Have y'all watched any of the training videos that's being released? Have you seen any of the players videos they've been posting on twitter/instagram? These guys are on vacation, or back visiting home and are working. Talent is awesome. Talent is great. If you don't work at it, and someone else that's just a little under your level is busting their ass, they're going to take it from you. Now I'm not saying Clemson's guys aren't out working too, but we're bringing in guys that are changing the culture. This isn't guys that are coming in to play 3 or 4 years and go to the NFL. It's guys coming in not just talking about championships, but are obviously putting in the work to challenge for championships.

    Some of you very clearly have never had to work to achieve anything in life whether it was for sports or a job. "Clemson just signed the '72 Dolphins" ... BECAUSE THEY JUST WON THE ****ING NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP ... that's literally how this works.

    Coach Muschamp and staff took a team that won 3 games and then won 6, and then won 9, and then won 7. Year over year the team had gotten better. Now, last year it was hard to tell and the record didn't show it, but the Offense went from like 110s to 40th in the nation. This year, with the schedule, the record may not tell the whole story either (although I believe we're going to surprise some people and do better than "expected"), but the goal is to get better. **** Clemson. I couldn't give a crap what recruiting classes or cupcake their schedule they have. South Carolina Football has to worry about making South Carolina Football better. That's how you "close the gap." You don't look at somebody else and worry about what they have versus what you have. You make yourself better and piss on them.
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    Quote Originally Posted by smoovecock View Post
    I agree with Cack.

  10. #350
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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    We offer about 4x the number of kids we can sign. Logic dictates we are going to have more misses than hits every year.
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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    Quote Originally Posted by cack View Post
    We have guys arguing a program not being on par with another that's won 2 national titles in 3 years while said original program was a 3 win team at the start of that run. "Oh Clemson has 50 5* DL that could suit up for New England next week and we don't. We're never going to compete with them." How do you think Clemson got to a level to compete with Bama year in and year out? "Oh no, Bama just signed their bazillionth 5*, we're never going to be as good as they are. We should just pack it up and stop trying. What's the use?"

    Have y'all watched any of the training videos that's being released? Have you seen any of the players videos they've been posting on twitter/instagram? These guys are on vacation, or back visiting home and are working. Talent is awesome. Talent is great. If you don't work at it, and someone else that's just a little under your level is busting their ass, they're going to take it from you. Now I'm not saying Clemson's guys aren't out working too, but we're bringing in guys that are changing the culture. This isn't guys that are coming in to play 3 or 4 years and go to the NFL. It's guys coming in not just talking about championships, but are obviously putting in the work to challenge for championships.

    Some of you very clearly have never had to work to achieve anything in life whether it was for sports or a job. "Clemson just signed the '72 Dolphins" ... BECAUSE THEY JUST WON THE ****ING NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP ... that's literally how this works.

    Coach Muschamp and staff took a team that won 3 games and then won 6, and then won 9, and then won 7. Year over year the team had gotten better. Now, last year it was hard to tell and the record didn't show it, but the Offense went from like 110s to 40th in the nation. This year, with the schedule, the record may not tell the whole story either (although I believe we're going to surprise some people and do better than "expected"), but the goal is to get better. **** Clemson. I couldn't give a crap what recruiting classes or cupcake their schedule they have. South Carolina Football has to worry about making South Carolina Football better. That's how you "close the gap." You don't look at somebody else and worry about what they have versus what you have. You make yourself better and piss on them.
    Well said....

  12. #352
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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    Quote Originally Posted by cack View Post
    We have guys arguing a program not being on par with another that's won 2 national titles in 3 years while said original program was a 3 win team at the start of that run. "Oh Clemson has 50 5* DL that could suit up for New England next week and we don't. We're never going to compete with them." How do you think Clemson got to a level to compete with Bama year in and year out? "Oh no, Bama just signed their bazillionth 5*, we're never going to be as good as they are. We should just pack it up and stop trying. What's the use?"

    Have y'all watched any of the training videos that's being released? Have you seen any of the players videos they've been posting on twitter/instagram? These guys are on vacation, or back visiting home and are working. Talent is awesome. Talent is great. If you don't work at it, and someone else that's just a little under your level is busting their ass, they're going to take it from you. Now I'm not saying Clemson's guys aren't out working too, but we're bringing in guys that are changing the culture. This isn't guys that are coming in to play 3 or 4 years and go to the NFL. It's guys coming in not just talking about championships, but are obviously putting in the work to challenge for championships.

    Some of you very clearly have never had to work to achieve anything in life whether it was for sports or a job. "Clemson just signed the '72 Dolphins" ... BECAUSE THEY JUST WON THE ****ING NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP ... that's literally how this works.

    Coach Muschamp and staff took a team that won 3 games and then won 6, and then won 9, and then won 7. Year over year the team had gotten better. Now, last year it was hard to tell and the record didn't show it, but the Offense went from like 110s to 40th in the nation. This year, with the schedule, the record may not tell the whole story either (although I believe we're going to surprise some people and do better than "expected"), but the goal is to get better. **** Clemson. I couldn't give a crap what recruiting classes or cupcake their schedule they have. South Carolina Football has to worry about making South Carolina Football better. That's how you "close the gap." You don't look at somebody else and worry about what they have versus what you have. You make yourself better and piss on them.

    I agree with Cack.
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  13. #353
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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    Quote Originally Posted by pitchcock View Post
    I love DJ Wonnum as a player. That said, he wouldn’t have started at Clemson last year or previously. Not 100% sure he’d start there this year.

    Steven Montac wouldn’t touch the field at Clemson.

    Hayden Hurst succeeded not only because he was a great athlete, but he pushed himself while a lot of our guys didn’t.


    Like I said, ON PAPER the gap is widening. They currently have 3 5* commits for DL. We’re praying we get one, while we’re losing out on DL prospects to UNC. They have quality depth at most positions, while we’re still in the situation of having one or two injuries at a position cause a bad domino effect. Doesn’t matter to me how many 5* QB’s they sign, barring injury only one will get substantial playing time. But when they’re stockpiling players that can switch in and out without a drop off in level of play, it makes them tougher to beat. It’s no different than UGA or Bama.

    They’ve been extraordinarily lucky as a program. They’ve had a very high “hit rate” for successful players, and by and large have avoided serious injuries.

    In contrast, we’ve had a lot of injuries, guys not quite pan out, guys at position of need transfer out, or guys just not qualify. They were happy to dump Josh Belk, while most of our fan base (including me) were happy to have him. Now a year later he’s left the program and driving a truck. We have to take more gambles right now, they don’t.

    I think Champ and his staff have done pretty much a miraculous job considering the hole they started in. If the fan base can remain patient (which based on posters here isn’t likely) I think he can turn the tide and slowly even things up.

    One thing Clemson has been able to do is secure highly rated commits early and hang on to them. On the other hand, we get a few highly rated commits, have interest from a few more highly rated guys, then have to sweat out whether we can keep them in the fold.

    What fixes that? Winning. Winning big. We somehow have to beat the odds against UGA and/or Bama, then take care of business against everyone else.
    That's the wrong way to view my post. You're right that Wonnum would not have started at Clemson in 2018. He would for sure start for Clemson this year. But the point was not about whether those players I mentioned were on the same level as Clemson. I was responding to a poster who claimed Muschamp and staff have yet to prove that they can develop players. The DEVELOPMENT of Wonnum, Montac, and Hurst prove otherwise. ZERO of those 3 players were thought of as being SEC caliber when they got here. All 3 have surpassed expectations. That = development.
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  14. #354
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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    Quote Originally Posted by Wisercock View Post
    Clemson has lost 2 games in the past 3 years and they have won 2 national championships by beating Alabama twice in the Championship game.

    DJ Wonnum is a good player but we need great players. Maybe Pickens and Hilinski will prove to be the ones to take us over the top, but I'm not confident enough (based on the past) to make that assessment. If they are that good I'll be the first one to applaud.
    Let's be real here, as much success as Clemson has had over the last 3 seasons, they are very very close to adding 4 or 5 more total losses to their record. They are good, but they have also had fortune on their side.

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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    Quote Originally Posted by pitchcock View Post
    I love DJ Wonnum as a player. That said, he wouldn’t have started at Clemson last year or previously. Not 100% sure he’d start there this year.

    Steven Montac wouldn’t touch the field at Clemson.

    Hayden Hurst succeeded not only because he was a great athlete, but he pushed himself while a lot of our guys didn’t.

    Like I said, ON PAPER the gap is widening. They currently have 3 5* commits for DL. We’re praying we get one, while we’re losing out on DL prospects to UNC. They have quality depth at most positions, while we’re still in the situation of having one or two injuries at a position cause a bad domino effect. Doesn’t matter to me how many 5* QB’s they sign, barring injury only one will get substantial playing time. But when they’re stockpiling players that can switch in and out without a drop off in level of play, it makes them tougher to beat. It’s no different than UGA or Bama.

    They’ve been extraordinarily lucky as a program. They’ve had a very high “hit rate” for successful players, and by and large have avoided serious injuries.

    In contrast, we’ve had a lot of injuries, guys not quite pan out, guys at position of need transfer out, or guys just not qualify. They were happy to dump Josh Belk, while most of our fan base (including me) were happy to have him. Now a year later he’s left the program and driving a truck. We have to take more gambles right now, they don’t.

    I think Champ and his staff have done pretty much a miraculous job considering the hole they started in. If the fan base can remain patient (which based on posters here isn’t likely) I think he can turn the tide and slowly even things up.

    One thing Clemson has been able to do is secure highly rated commits early and hang on to them. On the other hand, we get a few highly rated commits, have interest from a few more highly rated guys, then have to sweat out whether we can keep them in the fold.

    What fixes that? Winning. Winning big. We somehow have to beat the odds against UGA and/or Bama, then take care of business against everyone else.
    ^^ This.

    And you are more likely to have a high hit rate when you have high 4* and 5* players on the bench who want to play.

    Someone said above you only need 30 good players. I think most coaches would say you need to be 2 deep at every position. That's 44 guys. Add situational players and special teams and you need at least 56 players to field a successful team. While they don't necessarily have to all be 4 and 5 star players when you bring in a good group (top 15 class) every year it helps the hit rate. Clemson has been doing that for a long time.

    But then again, cluck femson. I too am tired of talking about them. Muschamp needs to produce over the next 2 seasons or that 6th year is going to be very uncomfortable.

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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    Quote Originally Posted by cack View Post
    We have guys arguing a program not being on par with another that's won 2 national titles in 3 years while said original program was a 3 win team at the start of that run. "Oh Clemson has 50 5* DL that could suit up for New England next week and we don't. We're never going to compete with them." How do you think Clemson got to a level to compete with Bama year in and year out? "Oh no, Bama just signed their bazillionth 5*, we're never going to be as good as they are. We should just pack it up and stop trying. What's the use?"

    Have y'all watched any of the training videos that's being released? Have you seen any of the players videos they've been posting on twitter/instagram? These guys are on vacation, or back visiting home and are working. Talent is awesome. Talent is great. If you don't work at it, and someone else that's just a little under your level is busting their ass, they're going to take it from you. Now I'm not saying Clemson's guys aren't out working too, but we're bringing in guys that are changing the culture. This isn't guys that are coming in to play 3 or 4 years and go to the NFL. It's guys coming in not just talking about championships, but are obviously putting in the work to challenge for championships.

    Some of you very clearly have never had to work to achieve anything in life whether it was for sports or a job. "Clemson just signed the '72 Dolphins" ... BECAUSE THEY JUST WON THE ****ING NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP ... that's literally how this works.

    Coach Muschamp and staff took a team that won 3 games and then won 6, and then won 9, and then won 7. Year over year the team had gotten better. Now, last year it was hard to tell and the record didn't show it, but the Offense went from like 110s to 40th in the nation. This year, with the schedule, the record may not tell the whole story either (although I believe we're going to surprise some people and do better than "expected"), but the goal is to get better. **** Clemson. I couldn't give a crap what recruiting classes or cupcake their schedule they have. South Carolina Football has to worry about making South Carolina Football better. That's how you "close the gap." You don't look at somebody else and worry about what they have versus what you have. You make yourself better and piss on them.
    How did Clemson get where they are? They struck gold with Watson that's how. We are not going to "out-recruit" them anytime soon. We can draw closer by catching a player like Watson and have some good fortune. But to say we can catch them just by the passage of time and good recruiting belies the entire history of the rivalry and the background and inner workings of the two programs.

    As of now the talent gap is still wide. Sure, we are recruiting better since before the 2015 season, but so is Clemson. To close that gap we either have to beat them on the field and show recruits we are for real or we have to match their recruiting, and not allow them to gain any more advantage. The former will fix things quicker. The latter will take time. To beat them on the field we have to find some guys who can elevate their game. Someone has to be a leader. The way last season ended left a bad taste in my mouth. I saw guys laying down not rising up. That has to change.

    In my humble opinion the coming season is not the one to judge the gap between the programs on the field. The season to do that is the following year. If there is progress then we keep going and try to narrow the gap some more. But we need to get lucky and have the ball bounce our way and get some guys like Jordan Burch and Tank Bigsby to come and play here.

    Those are the things I will be watching over the next few years.

  17. #357
    1st Team All-SEC pitchcock's Avatar
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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    Quote Originally Posted by cockyboy View Post
    Let's be real here, as much success as Clemson has had over the last 3 seasons, they are very very close to adding 4 or 5 more total losses to their record. They are good, but they have also had fortune on their side.
    You always need an element of luck. We had our fair share of luck during our run of 11 win seasons.

    Lucky or not, they’ve still won two out of the last three National Championships. And they’re reaping the rewards.

    I truly believe Champ can get us there. But in the meantime, some of our fan base need to drop the delusion that we’re rapidly narrowing the Clemson talent gap, or that Champ should be replaced after this season if we don’t win the East.

    I’m hoping we can steal a win from either Bama or UGA. I’m hoping we show up to play against Kentucky. I’m hoping we show up against UF and UT.

    To do that we need to avoid injuries, make plays, and have that element of luck.

  18. #358
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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    During Carolina's "Golden Age" we were 3-7 vs Clemson in recruiting as far as the rankings have it. Don't believe the hype folks, thinking you are falling behind by getting less 5* is a kin to thinking every number 1 pick in the NFL draft goes to the Hall of Fame.
    Last edited by thedude0486; 07-11-2019 at 05:05 PM.

  19. #359
    1st Team All-SEC Wisercock's Avatar
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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    Quote Originally Posted by thedude0486 View Post
    During Carolina's "Golden Age" we were 3-7 vs Clemson in recruiting as far as the rankings have it. Don't believe the hype folks, thinking you are falling behind by getting less 5* is a kin to thinking every number 1 pick in the NFL draft goes to the Hall of Fame.
    This may turn out to be right, but it was a different set of circumstances.

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    Default Re: Discussion: 2020 Recruiting Impressions

    Quote Originally Posted by cack View Post
    We have guys arguing a program not being on par with another that's won 2 national titles in 3 years while said original program was a 3 win team at the start of that run. "Oh Clemson has 50 5* DL that could suit up for New England next week and we don't. We're never going to compete with them." How do you think Clemson got to a level to compete with Bama year in and year out? "Oh no, Bama just signed their bazillionth 5*, we're never going to be as good as they are. We should just pack it up and stop trying. What's the use?"

    Have y'all watched any of the training videos that's being released? Have you seen any of the players videos they've been posting on twitter/instagram? These guys are on vacation, or back visiting home and are working. Talent is awesome. Talent is great. If you don't work at it, and someone else that's just a little under your level is busting their ass, they're going to take it from you. Now I'm not saying Clemson's guys aren't out working too, but we're bringing in guys that are changing the culture. This isn't guys that are coming in to play 3 or 4 years and go to the NFL. It's guys coming in not just talking about championships, but are obviously putting in the work to challenge for championships.

    Some of you very clearly have never had to work to achieve anything in life whether it was for sports or a job. "Clemson just signed the '72 Dolphins" ... BECAUSE THEY JUST WON THE ****ING NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP ... that's literally how this works.

    Coach Muschamp and staff took a team that won 3 games and then won 6, and then won 9, and then won 7. Year over year the team had gotten better. Now, last year it was hard to tell and the record didn't show it, but the Offense went from like 110s to 40th in the nation. This year, with the schedule, the record may not tell the whole story either (although I believe we're going to surprise some people and do better than "expected"), but the goal is to get better. **** Clemson. I couldn't give a crap what recruiting classes or cupcake their schedule they have. South Carolina Football has to worry about making South Carolina Football better. That's how you "close the gap." You don't look at somebody else and worry about what they have versus what you have. You make yourself better and piss on them.
    Right. because wins and losses don't matter. Moral victories maybe good enough for some , but people who live in reality know better. Getting blown out by amid tier ACC program like UVA tells me all I need to know about the future of this program under Muschamp.

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