Was Spurrier Wrong?

[SportyCock]

I don't think Spurrier was wrong to say we could challenge for the SEC this past year. When he said it we had Sidney Rice and Jasper Brinkley, our two best players and potential All-Americans, both. Furthermore, these two could have solved two of our four problems, ie run defense and another receiver besides McKinley. (The O-line would have still been our biggest weakness, and special teams would have still been a disappointment, though Spurrier had reason to expect improvement there.)

These two would have definitely gotten us through Vandy and TN in the SEC, and Clemson. That makes us 9-3 overall and 5-3 in the SEC East, finishing second to GA (6-2) via winning the tiebreaker with TN (5-3 with loss to us).

Brinkley would have also relieved a lot of the stress and pressure, not to mention direct wear and tear (Brinkley making tackles before Cook had to), that eventually broke down our defense with injuries and plain old tiredness. The loss of Nathan Pepper, the disabling shoulder injury to Isaac and the shorter-lived injuries to Cook and Munnerlyn, changed the team's abilities/potential dramatically. Sure every team has injuries/losses, but not usually to so many or to such critical contributors.

I think the cumulative wear and tear that came from the loss of Brinkley and Pepper, compounded by the injuries in the secondary lead to the breakdown in effort on defense that resulted in the blowout games against Arkansas and Florida. Could we have beaten either one of these teams without the breakdown in effort on defense, and with Brinkley at linebacker? Of course we could have. Just one of the two puts us in a tie with GA and we win the tiebreaker.

Moreover, Rice would have challenged defenses and pulled double coverage, opening up the run as well as the pass. This would have relieved the pressure to try Smelley at QB and kept Mitchell's confidence up. A better performing offense also takes pressure off the defense, which carried us through the first half of the season. If we score more and sooner in games, opponents are forced to pass more to catch up. Do ya think that would have played into our hands?

I'm sure other teams had injuries and losses to early draft entry, though I doubt any had such critical losses. But the point is that when Spurrier made this prediction, at the stadium upon arriving back from the bowl win, he had very good reasons to make it.

[SNEEZ]

we went 6-6 overall and 2-3 in the EAST

yes I'd say he was wrong.

[Spurticus]

He wasn't wrong in the assesment that we could contend for the Eastern Conference Title. He was wrong in believing the players wanted it as much as he did and wrong in believing the players could play football at the level of their potential.

That to me was the most frustrating part of the collapes. Even with Brinkley and Pepper out, there's no way we should have lost to Clemson or Vanderbilt this year AT LEAST.
I saw some disaster looming down the road, but felt even at that, we were an 8-4 team. . . . This team had the potential to win 10 games this season but ended up losing 3 games that were very winable even with the embarassments at the hands of Arkansas and Florida. The biggest one was Vanderbilt. . . . That's a game we should have won with our practice team on the field (say what you want to about Vandy being an improved team, but we've beaten better Vandy teams with FAR less talent than we had on the field this past year). That game gets us in a bowl game dispite the other losses. Clemson and UT were games that reeked of "come take it" and we didn't want to win it.

A lot of people have opinions about what happened and most of those opinions point to coaches. I however don't agree that our coaches were the cause of that trainwreck. . . . . . Decent coaches could have had a much better season doing less with the players that ours have done, but the problem (I Think) is, when coaches instruct, they naturally assume that Players want to win games. . . . Ours do not. It's hard to win consistantly anywhere, but it's even harder to win consistantly in the SEC (more specifically, the SEC East). You have to go way beyond basics and way beyond your best effort to win here and that comes from within. It can be told to your players that they need to reach beyond your limits of endurance, and strength when the game is on the line, but unless the players believe they can . . .you might as well be saying the same thing to the Cheerleaders and waterboys. All coaches can do is keep putting guys in until they find someone who can take "potential" from the practice field, to "maximum effort" on the playing field. . . . . . ie: Deon Lecorn.
He was passed over for reps during the game for pretty much every other receiver on the roster, but when he got his chance, he proved he has GAME. These are the kids we have to find and put on the field. It may be the ones who are so-so during the week, but when the whistle sounds and it's time to hit someone, the light comes on. . . . . the ones with a warrior mentality. Right now, we don't have nearly enough of those guys on the field at the same time.

[ConwayGamecock]

Originally Posted by Spurticus

He wasn't wrong in the assesment that we could contend for the Eastern Conference Title. He was wrong in believing the players wanted it as much as he did and wrong in believing the players could play football at the level of their potential.

That to me was the most frustrating part of the collapes. Even with Brinkley and Pepper out, there's no way we should have lost to Clemson or Vanderbilt this year AT LEAST.
I saw some disaster looming down the road, but felt even at that, we were an 8-4 team. . . . This team had the potential to win 10 games this season but ended up losing 3 games that were very winable even with the embarassments at the hands of Arkansas and Florida. The biggest one was Vanderbilt. . . . That's a game we should have won with our practice team on the field (say what you want to about Vandy being an improved team, but we've beaten better Vandy teams with FAR less talent than we had on the field this past year). That game gets us in a bowl game dispite the other losses. Clemson and UT were games that reeked of "come take it" and we didn't want to win it.

A lot of people have opinions about what happened and most of those opinions point to coaches. I however don't agree that our coaches were the cause of that trainwreck. . . . . . Decent coaches could have had a much better season doing less with the players that ours have done, but the problem (I Think) is, when coaches instruct, they naturally assume that Players want to win games. . . . Ours do not. It's hard to win consistantly anywhere, but it's even harder to win consistantly in the SEC (more specifically, the SEC East). You have to go way beyond basics and way beyond your best effort to win here and that comes from within. It can be told to your players that they need to reach beyond your limits of endurance, and strength when the game is on the line, but unless the players believe they can . . .you might as well be saying the same thing to the Cheerleaders and waterboys. All coaches can do is keep putting guys in until they find someone who can take "potential" from the practice field, to "maximum effort" on the playing field. . . . . . ie: Deon Lecorn.
He was passed over for reps during the game for pretty much every other receiver on the roster, but when he got his chance, he proved he has GAME. These are the kids we have to find and put on the field. It may be the ones who are so-so during the week, but when the whistle sounds and it's time to hit someone, the light comes on. . . . . the ones with a warrior mentality. Right now, we don't have nearly enough of those guys on the field at the same time.

I agree with this 100%: our offense never really became an effective, disciplined offense. Our defense was the main reason we were 6-1 and 3-1 in the SEC, but our O-line could - or would - never develop into a dependable blocking unit, either for running or passing. Our young WR's were slow to develop into players that could produce anything more than a token reception per game. Our QB position was in turmoil for 60% of the season.

Even with the rushing defense issues, our D held firm for as long as they could. If our offense was able to just play moderate ball, without all the foot-shooting, rally-killing turnovers, penalties and missed assignments, IMO we would've beaten Vandy, Tennessee, and Clemson. We would've finished 9-3 instead of 6-6. And 5-3 in the SEC, instead of 3-5. And the game with Florida would've been a hell of a lot closer than it was, although we still would've lost, IMO. Georgia would've won the East, and we'd be tied with UF and UT for 2nd. We would've competed for the East right up until the last game with Florida, which is what Spurrier predicted we would do.

But like Spurticus said, our players needed to compete, and they didn't on offense. I was tired of seeing our opponents come out for games - even at W-B - fired up and pumped, and then watch our guys just run out onto the field like another day at the office. I was tired of seeing opposing D's keep blocking past the whistle, while many of our guys would stop once they see the play didn't involve them, even BEFORE the whistle. They need to learn to take more pride in what they're doing on the field.

USC led the SEC in QB sacks allowed, and led the SEC in false starts for the O-line, and our run offense was dead last in the SEC, despite having a top RB in Cory Boyd.

[garnet4ever]

Originally Posted by Spurticus

All coaches can do is keep putting guys in until they find someone who can take "potential" from the practice field, to "maximum effort" on the playing field. . . . . . ie: Deon Lecorn.
He was passed over for reps during the game for pretty much every other receiver on the roster, but when he got his chance, he proved he has GAME. These are the kids we have to find and put on the field. It may be the ones who are so-so during the week, but when the whistle sounds and it's time to hit someone, the light comes on. . . . . the ones with a warrior mentality. Right now, we don't have nearly enough of those guys on the field at the same time.

I talked about that in a thread during the season. Some guys don't practice well, but once they get on the field they're totally different. Anyone can go through the routines, but can they make it on the field ... glad to see you commented on that ...

[Freehawk]

Originally Posted by garnet4ever

I talked about that in a thread during the season. Some guys don't practice well, but once they get on the field they're totally different. Anyone can go through the routines, but can they make it on the field ... glad to see you commented on that ...

True, and if you don't practice well it is hard to get on the field. Unfortunately you also have the opposite -- practice warriors -- who don't play as well in games. This is a hard part of a coaches job.

Hopefully we get everybody back we are expecting. B52, Kmc11, Lindseys, Pepper, Captain etc. I think some other players, such as Marque Hall with more time after his injury, will also play better. I think the returning OL players will get stronger. We need to figure out those WRs after 11 and 18.

[superstar90]

Originally Posted by Spurticus

He wasn't wrong in the assesment that we could contend for the Eastern Conference Title. He was wrong in believing the players wanted it as much as he did and wrong in believing the players could play football at the level of their potential.

That to me was the most frustrating part of the collapes. Even with Brinkley and Pepper out, there's no way we should have lost to Clemson or Vanderbilt this year AT LEAST.
I saw some disaster looming down the road, but felt even at that, we were an 8-4 team. . . . This team had the potential to win 10 games this season but ended up losing 3 games that were very winable even with the embarassments at the hands of Arkansas and Florida. The biggest one was Vanderbilt. . . . That's a game we should have won with our practice team on the field (say what you want to about Vandy being an improved team, but we've beaten better Vandy teams with FAR less talent than we had on the field this past year). That game gets us in a bowl game dispite the other losses. Clemson and UT were games that reeked of "come take it" and we didn't want to win it.

A lot of people have opinions about what happened and most of those opinions point to coaches. I however don't agree that our coaches were the cause of that trainwreck. . . . . . Decent coaches could have had a much better season doing less with the players that ours have done, but the problem (I Think) is, when coaches instruct, they naturally assume that Players want to win games. . . . Ours do not. It's hard to win consistantly anywhere, but it's even harder to win consistantly in the SEC (more specifically, the SEC East). You have to go way beyond basics and way beyond your best effort to win here and that comes from within. It can be told to your players that they need to reach beyond your limits of endurance, and strength when the game is on the line, but unless the players believe they can . . .you might as well be saying the same thing to the Cheerleaders and waterboys. All coaches can do is keep putting guys in until they find someone who can take "potential" from the practice field, to "maximum effort" on the playing field. . . . . . ie: Deon Lecorn.
He was passed over for reps during the game for pretty much every other receiver on the roster, but when he got his chance, he proved he has GAME. These are the kids we have to find and put on the field. It may be the ones who are so-so during the week, but when the whistle sounds and it's time to hit someone, the light comes on. . . . . the ones with a warrior mentality. Right now, we don't have nearly enough of those guys on the field at the same time.

That part in bold there is somewhat true in my mind, but the coaches still deserve a good bit of the blame and SOS would admit that in a minute. I really believe Nix had two of the worst gameplans ever in the Ark. and UF game. They all have bad days as coaches, but he really laid an egg there. It's kind of hard as a player to keep going wide open when you lose faith in the play calling. Even SOS had some bad play calling. I saw more this season than the first two combined. SOS seemed determined to do some things when we just didn't have the line to do it, and it cost us. ex: Vandy couldn't stop us from running the ball, but coach decided to put the ball in the air and we never recovered.
I do agree though at times our guys just seemed slow and lazy, but I don't know what the problem is. Most of that lack of effort seemed to come from the Oline, and I believe after 8 or 9 games of the same crappy Oline play it started to wear on the rest of the team.

[Acockolypse Now]

Originally Posted by Spurticus

Decent coaches could have had a much better season doing less with the players that ours have done, but the problem (I Think) is, when coaches instruct, they naturally assume that Players want to win games. . . . Ours do not. It's hard to win consistantly anywhere, but it's even harder to win consistantly in the SEC (more specifically, the SEC East). You have to go way beyond basics and way beyond your best effort to win here and that comes from within. It can be told to your players that they need to reach beyond your limits of endurance, and strength when the game is on the line, but unless the players believe they can . . .you might as well be saying the same thing to the Cheerleaders and waterboys. All coaches can do is keep putting guys in until they find someone who can take "potential" from the practice field, to "maximum effort" on the playing field. . . . . . ie: Deon Lecorn.
He was passed over for reps during the game for pretty much every other receiver on the roster, but when he got his chance, he proved he has GAME. These are the kids we have to find and put on the field. It may be the ones who are so-so during the week, but when the whistle sounds and it's time to hit someone, the light comes on. . . . . the ones with a warrior mentality. Right now, we don't have nearly enough of those guys on the field at the same time.

That might be the best post of the year.

Amen, I'd watch Cory and wonder what our team would be like if they all had his heart and desire.

[Hopefultiger]

Dont be too hard on your guys. It's got to be hard to play at your best week after week. USC is not alone. Clemson played to lose vs USC as well. Looking around Div I you see every top 10 team got beat by someone ... usually someone they were better than.

[mickeyrivers]

Originally Posted by Hopefultiger

Dont be too hard on your guys. It's got to be hard to play at your best week after week. USC is not alone. Clemson played to lose vs USC as well. Looking around Div I you see every top 10 team got beat by someone ... usually someone they were better than.

go watch the clemson game... watch mike davis attempt to "block" the guy rushing the kicker on the first punt block. that is the kind of crap we need to get rid of in the football program.

i can handle losing games. being a gamecock fan i'm used to it. what gets under my skin is watching players go through the motions.

[jellafever]

you cant go 2-4 in the east.

[Dr. Cock]

Not a bad post, but even Spurrier himself admitted he shouldn't have said that we we're ready to challenge. We have the starting talent in the skill player positions, but we still lack big uglies and even further lack quality depth.

[Kendalls Daddy]

I don't think Spurrier was wrong. On paper we had a better team that showed up. 5th year QB(who was suspended), better D Line(lost Pepper and Jordin Lindsay dnp), great LBs(lost Jasper) and good dbs(Munnerlyn may have been a difference vs Clemson). Both Rbs were back and we had a handful of WRs that were gamebreakers(McKinfley and Lecorn were the only 2 that stepped up)..Better Special teams(didn't happen).
Did he know that we would allow 500 yds to Ark on the ground? Probaly not. He probaly thought his players would show up and beat Vandy. We lost to CU and TN on FGs as the last play of the game. Beating UGA at their place is evidence we should've competed. Plus, we won out last year and a W in the bowl game against a good Houston team + a top 5 recruiting class.
He had plenty of reason to make that statement. Now, he should have more questions in the offseason to answer in order to make the same statement next year.

[RHHS8068]

No, he was not wrong.

He didn't say we'd win the East. He said we'd compete. He beat the #2 team in the East in Athens and lost to the #1 team in the East in OT in Knox.

We completed. We just didn't win it.

[OLDCOCK]

No he was not! He just as we thought these kids would progress better than the kids from last yr! Lets start at the beginning. 1st of all he anticipated having Rice back! 2ndly he could not anticipate the loss of Jap which in fact was a killer to the defense! We also lost our biggest and most physical DE Pepper which might have been the biggest loss of the yr!! It caused a chain reaction of moves which weaken us to the point where we could not physically match up with most foes we just diddnt have the depth yet! To make matters worst early probably our best cover guy Issac rehurt a shoulder which limited our sec to the point that C thomas was a main cover guy and he is just not that type player yet. Then in the end we lost Munnerlyn which did cripple us in the sec and actually forced true freshman to have to cover 1 on 1 which they were not ready for! The offensive line was the culprit again early in the season and obc was told by Hunt that it would be much better this yr and would be ready from the git go ! Wrong on both counts!! It was worst and it took longer top get them together and they never really fully reached the level that last yr unit got to! The Qb issues were something I believe to be OBCs fault because Blake was clearly our best option for the start he made a bad call there. The wide reciever issue started when Sid did not come back .Mckinnely clearly was not a no1 at the start and we had a TE for a 2! He hoped some of the fresh wide outs would blossom early and they just were not able to grasp the offense well enough to contibute! It is a pretty complex passing system of time routes and reading defenses. 1 thing after another including the complete collaspe of our special teams which was thought to be in the good hands of Beamer and Chatam turned out to be a complete farce all season long and never got fixed! What we did do is get loads of experience for our younger guys we also had 3 guys make 1st team SEC which I dont believe has ever happened to us! A yr under the belt of all these young guys and a good recruiting effort will only add depth and give us more reason to believe the road we are on is the right 1. I for one dont know how he held it together as well as he did. Our offense will change a little this coming yr because of the yr we just experienced- We will be much better and more prepaired for the tough time any team experiences in the SEC. I believe the building blocks are being put in the correct places and we are headed in the fast lane to championship calibre football . Have faith my freinds we will be there shortly!

[TheGuitarCock]

I don't see anything wrong. He said we were ready to "Compete" not win. Everyone trys to "compete".

We are at the level where we can...just think, we show up against Vandy, Land on a fumble in Knoxville and Uf is our only loss in the east

[Dr. Cock]

Originally Posted by TheGuitarCock

I don't see anything wrong. He said we were ready to "Compete" not win. Everyone trys to "compete".

We are at the level where we can...just think, we show up against Vandy, Land on a fumble in Knoxville and Uf is our only loss in the east

You have to be careful with that logic though. What if E Cook doesn't deflect the endzone pass against UGA? What if UNC catches that Hail Mary pass at the end? It can always go either way. The best thing to do is to just make your breaks, but luck will always be a factor in football. Unfortunately, we are rarely on the receiving end of it. Even further is the fact that we need to learn to capitilize on those oppurtunities we do receive it as well.

[TheGuitarCock]

Originally Posted by Dr. Cock

You have to be careful with that logic though. What if E Cook doesn't deflect the endzone pass against UGA? What if UNC catches that Hail Mary pass at the end? It can always go either way. The best thing to do is to just make your breaks, but luck will always be a factor in football. Unfortunately, we are rarely on the receiving end of it. Even further is the fact that we need to learn to capitilize on those oppurtunities we do receive it as well.

[Click]

He may have been wrong in the end, but setting high expectations is something I think is needed at USC because we're capable of doing it. Like SOS said "why not us?"

[roosterrizk1]

Dr Cock,

What if we recover fumbles against UT and don't turnt he ball over 15 times over our last 3 games. Hindsight is 20-20. If we recover the fumble against UT the game was over.