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Old 11-25-2012, 04:02 PM   #1
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Default Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

These teams are 1 and 4 in the AP. ND only played 2 teams in the top 20 this year Stanford and Oklahoma and won both. Ohio St only played 2 teams in the top 20 this year Nebraska and Michigan (16 and 22) and won both. It's very troubling to me that these teams continue to get the recognition and yet play very easy schedules.

We played 4 teams (2 of them are in the top 5) and we won 2 and lost 2. The taters played 2 teams Carolina and Fla St and lost both. The point is, the SEC, PAC 12 and Big 12 are the best conferences (in that order) and are much better than the Big 10 and lightyears ahead of the ACC-X......X means soon to be gone.
We all know money is the driving force with all the realignment in college football. The SEC now has 6 teams in the top 10, but only 2 are allowed to play in the top bowls. With the new playoff/bowls to take place in 2 years, the 2 team max will be gone and I believe the SEC could get 4 or maybe even 5 of the 12 teams playing for the national championship (4 teams) and the other top 4 bowls (8 teams).
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Old 11-25-2012, 04:41 PM   #2
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

Notre dame beat michigan as well
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Old 11-25-2012, 06:49 PM   #3
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

Conferences still have bowl tie Ins.

SEC gained the orange bowl
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Old 11-26-2012, 06:19 PM   #4
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

Ok, so I had this argument today and Pat Forde wrote a column about it as well. I put together a visual to try to get a better handle on it. The basic outline is that while the SEC gets the benefit of the doubt ND has actually played a better overall schedule than Alabama and Georgia...

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Old 11-26-2012, 06:29 PM   #5
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

ND has played 8 bowl eligible team and no non BCS conference teams. OSU has played a fr less impressive schedule than ND. Also So Cal has 5 losses but 3 of them are to top 8 teams, so that's an impressive win that your numbers ignore. So Cal was a favorite to win the national title prior to the season, they didn't suddenly become unathletic just because they lost some games. Also ND, like a Bama, will always get everyone's best game.

People always ignore the moment of a season and how a loss can mess up the rest of the year. Just look how the winner of the Carolina vs UGA normally has a good year and the other suffers. The same can be said of Michigan vs. ND or Michigan State vs ND, lastly if Miami had won do you think they might not have had a better year.

ND wasn't best team to start year and may not be the best team on paper, but they have earned a chance through their play to play for it all.
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Old 11-26-2012, 06:33 PM   #6
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

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ND has played 8 bowl eligible team and no non BCS conference teams. OSU has played a fr less impressive schedule than ND. Also So Cal has 5 losses but 3 of them are to top 8 teams, so that's an impressive win that your numbers ignore. So Cal was a favorite to win the national title prior to the season, they didn't suddenly become unathletic just because they lost some games. Also ND, like a Bama, will always get everyone's best game.

People always ignore the moment of a season and how a loss can mess up the rest of the year. Just look how the winner of the Carolina vs UGA normally has a good year and the other suffers. The same can be said of Michigan vs. ND or Michigan State vs ND, lastly if Miami had won do you think they might not have had a better year.

ND wasn't best team to start year and may not be the best team on paper, but they have earned a chance through their play to play for it all.
How do the numbers ignore Southern Cal's performances? They still rank fairly well.
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Old 11-26-2012, 06:33 PM   #7
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

ND's strength of schedule benefits from playing "traditional" schools that aren't actually very good this year.

But they have definitely earned the right to play in the championship.
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Old 11-26-2012, 06:38 PM   #8
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

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ND's strength of schedule benefits from playing "traditional" schools that aren't actually very good this year.

But they have definitely earned the right to play in the championship.
Hmmm... I'd actually say that its the opposite, 'Bama and Georgia are getting an unfair benefit of the doubt even with having more bad teams on their schedule and the middle of the SEC being worse than you'd expect.
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Old 11-26-2012, 06:41 PM   #9
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

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How do the numbers ignore Southern Cal's performances? They still rank fairly well.
They don't even count as beating a ranked team, so no people and the system ignore the value of that win.

Edit: my first response about numbers was more directed to the OP not your computer rankings.
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Old 11-26-2012, 06:46 PM   #10
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

ND beat a lot of bad teams too this year. I don't know how many of them got into bowls, only because they don't play anyone either.
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Old 11-27-2012, 12:02 AM   #11
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

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Originally Posted by USCgamecocks View Post
Ok, so I had this argument today and Pat Forde wrote a column about it as well. I put together a visual to try to get a better handle on it. The basic outline is that while the SEC gets the benefit of the doubt ND has actually played a better overall schedule than Alabama and Georgia...

Some of these numbers make absolutely no sense. On Georgia's schedule, USC ranks 17.5
Half of the teams ranked on ND's schedule seem way off like Okla 8, Mich 18, Mich St 22, BYU 25.....same thing on Ohio St schedule like Nebraska 11, Mich 18, Mich St 22, Wis 23.
#3 of the 4 ratings were a week old and have changed. I'd like to see it now after the season.

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/sagarin/fbt12.htm

Here is Sagarin's ranking.....there's a lot of difference between this and the other attachment.

Neb 17
Wis 32
Mich St 39
BYU 37

If you look at the top 10, almost exactly the same as the BCS.
Very accurate if you ask me.

Also look at the column to see how the teams have done against the top 30.
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Old 11-27-2012, 07:15 AM   #12
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

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Some of these numbers make absolutely no sense. On Georgia's schedule, USC ranks 17.5
Half of the teams ranked on ND's schedule seem way off like Okla 8, Mich 18, Mich St 22, BYU 25.....same thing on Ohio St schedule like Nebraska 11, Mich 18, Mich St 22, Wis 23.
#3 of the 4 ratings were a week old and have changed. I'd like to see it now after the season.

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/sagarin/fbt12.htm

Here is Sagarin's ranking.....there's a lot of difference between this and the other attachment.

Neb 17
Wis 32
Mich St 39
BYU 37

If you look at the top 10, almost exactly the same as the BCS.
Very accurate if you ask me.

Also look at the column to see how the teams have done against the top 30.
The final average numbers in the rightmost column are an average of the 4 advanced metric rankings. Thats the entire point of using multiple rankings., USC does great in the Sagarin ratings but does poorly on others based on efficiency. Football Outsiders uses F/+ as their preferred advanced metric ranking. LINK Just because you don't like it doesn't invalidate their methods...

I did note that three of the rankings were not updated through this week because as of yesterday early afternoon they were not published, some now are and will be updated on my sheet later.
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Old 11-27-2012, 12:55 PM   #13
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

i'll pass on the computers and metrics. sagarin overly punishes you for playing a fcs team. basically notre dame has played more consistently mediocre teams than uga and alabama. notre dame does deserve their spot currently because they do have two good quality wins and theyre undefeated. i wouldnt consider southern cal a quality win because despite 4 losses to teams with at least 9 wins, they did lose to a fellow 7 win team and dont have any quality wins of their own.
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Old 11-27-2012, 12:59 PM   #14
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

ND's strength of schedule was widely ranked as the hardest before the season. It's not their fault all those teams fell on their dicks. They won every game. I think they belong.
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Old 11-27-2012, 01:11 PM   #15
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

not in this instance because notre dame will have a top 2 resume, but if you had the preseason no.1 schedule and it ended up being weak and two teams had a better resume than you, youre out of luck.


you cant control your schedule during the season, but i hate that you play your schedule cliche. when oregon was no.1 and hadnt beaten anybody, everyone said it didnt matter because they were supposedly a clear top 2 team. not to make it just about oregon, you can say the same thing about the invincible crimson tide before they played someone good. which is why i would have ranked notre dame no.1 before oregon and alabama lost, and i hate notre dame. to prove yourself as a top team, you have to actually beat good teams.
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Old 11-27-2012, 01:16 PM   #16
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

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Hmmm... I'd actually say that its the opposite, 'Bama and Georgia are getting an unfair benefit of the doubt even with having more bad teams on their schedule and the middle of the SEC being worse than you'd expect.
This. Uga's schedule is about as close to an acc schedule as you can get in the sec. Notre Dame's schedule is far and away better than uga's.
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Old 11-27-2012, 01:22 PM   #17
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

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This. Uga's schedule is about as close to an acc schedule as you can get in the sec. Notre Dame's schedule is far and away better than uga's.
Not to mention Bama avoided us, UGA, and Florida. They beat LSU but lost their other tough game at home. Bama's schedule wasn't exactly loaded.
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Old 11-27-2012, 01:28 PM   #18
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

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Not to mention Bama avoided us, UGA, and Florida. They beat LSU but lost their other tough game at home. Bama's schedule wasn't exactly loaded.
Bama had a stretch of tenn, miss st, and lsu on the road I believe...then the a&m game. It's not just about how many "hard" games per se..it's the schedule. Uga didn't play 2 "hard" games back-to-back all year. Every other SEC team in the top 10 had at least a tuff 2-3 game stretch in their schedule...USC, florida, and lsu had BRUTAL stretches in their schedule. SOrry...guess i'm still pouting about uga making it to the SECCG..but they are the third best team in the East and if they had either ours or uf's schedule they wouldn't even sniff Atlanta. Mother**** georgia!
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Old 11-27-2012, 01:32 PM   #19
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

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Bama had a stretch of tenn, miss st, and lsu on the road I believe...then the a&m game. It's not just about how many "hard" games per se..it's the schedule. Uga didn't play 2 "hard" games back-to-back all year. Every other SEC team in the top 10 had at least a tuff 2-3 game stretch in their schedule...USC, florida, and lsu had BRUTAL stretches in their schedule. SOrry...guess i'm still pouting about uga making it to the SECCG..but they are the third best team in the East and if they had either ours or uf's schedule they wouldn't even sniff Atlanta. Mother**** georgia!
don't know if I'd call Tenn & MSU tough games but they were on the road so I see where ya coming from.
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Old 11-27-2012, 01:37 PM   #20
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Default Re: Notre Dame and Ohio State Strength of Schedule: Comparisons

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don't know if I'd call Tenn & MSU tough games but they were on the road so I see where ya coming from.
I could see uga going 2-2 in that stretch...maybe 1-3. The ONLY team they have beaten in 3 years worth a damn was a Florida team that turned the ball over 6 times. Uga is good at beating lesser SEC opponents like they should when they play them at home....but they are paper SECE champions
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