My latest installment of past game updates...

[Cocky2001]

Originally Posted by snoopcockycock

you appear to be one of the dumbest persons i have ever read a post from.

That simply means that you have the good sense to disagree with Snoopy here...and of course, the 'facts' that he offers are insults to the disagreeing poster

Originally Posted by snoopcockycock

sorry, sometimes i get a little fired up when some ill-informed poster spouts off at the mouth.

Then you should live in a constant state of being 'fired up' with every post that you make.

Originally Posted by yazoo

Note to self: when insulting somebody for being super-stupid, make sure all words in post are correctly spelled.

Originally Posted by Cheezy

What snoopy is trying to say is that we should never discuss football on a football discussion forum. We may only post articles and messages that come directly from coaches or the athletic department, and we must not question any decisions made by the team, even hypothetically in typical message board fashion.

Hate to disagree with you, but what Snoopy is trying to say here is that you should all bow down to his insightfulness and only quote him and only believe things that you hear from him.

Originally Posted by MikeTrainNC8

hahahaha brilliant post.

"gripitandripit2007".. I think you are the same person as this snoopy character, neither of ya'll seem to have heard of paragraphs. It helps people better understand your point.

For you to say that Shaw is smart and efficient is laughable. He is smart and gritty, but efficient? Not knowing to get rid of the ball under pressure is not efficient at ALL. Consistently not making full reads and just taking off is not efficient. Under throwing our fast receivers is not efficient.

Yes he was the QB of a 10-2 team, but you act like it's only because of him that we were that good. It was because we had the greatest player in the nation, a nasty defense, great ST players, and an amazing RB (not to mention our head coach).

Post of the Thread!

Ask Alshon Jeffery how 'complete' of a QB Shaw is. In his last game for us, he basically thought, "Screw this", started a fight and watched the remainder of the game in the locker room on tv.

Originally Posted by snoopcockycock

no, actually if you read my post, you would see that i prefer to stir up discussion. but part of that discussion should be backing up your pov with facts, not just...

...bashing any and every one that has the good common sense to disagree with you?

So...you 'stir up discussion' and bash those disagreeing with you...I guess that makes you the CT Jim Rome...you should be proud.

You are 7000 miles away and posting on games that took place a month ago and yet you know more than these guys who were actually there and have watched the game 10 times since it happened and been discussing it for weeks during lunch breaks with friends before you ever see it for the first time.

[gripitandripit2007]

Originally Posted by Cocky2001

Post of the Thread!

Ask Alshon Jeffery how 'complete' of a QB Shaw is. In his last game for us, he basically thought, "Screw this", started a fight and watched the remainder of the game in the locker room on tv.

If you think that is what AJ did you are one of the most blinded & delerious fans I have ever saw. He was MVP of the bowl game and Denard was harassing him the whole time...AJ had all he could take & eventually had enough & reacted but why would he quit...when he finally had a QB that would help him win a bowl game before he left? The other one couldn't do it in 3 years...Connor led them to win one his first year

[Cocky2001]

Originally Posted by gripitandripit2007

If you think that is what AJ did you are one of the most blinded & delerious fans I have ever saw. He was MVP of the bowl game and Denard was harassing him the whole time...AJ had all he could take & eventually had enough & reacted but why would he quit...when he finally had a QB that would help him win a bowl game before he left? The other one couldn't do it in 3 years...Connor led them to win one his first year

To be honest, that's not original to me...and I pretty much see it the way you state...I just threw that out there to see what the master of insight Snoop would say. The guy who told me this (with conviction I might add) really didn't like Shaw and I was on the other side of this discussion that day. I really do like Shaw, I just think that Thompson is a more complete QB and would prove so if he had the chances. I am more than comfortable with either of them QBing us in the bowl game. I guess Snoop didn't want to post on this one...I was looking forward to what he had to say.

[pantera17]

Okay. Let's look at what we know. From what we as gamecock fans have seen through Connor and Dylan's careers. Now everyone that watches gamecock football has seen these. So we all know them to be true.

Connor Shaw:
Great athlete. Very fast.
Hard worker. Wants to get better.
Smart QB. Doesn't force passes.

Weak arm. There are some throws he just can't put enough on to make.

Shaw's first pass of the 2012 season was an route about 20yards down the field. Shaw couldn't get enough on the ball and it was picked off. After that we really didn't see shaw even attempt to make throws like that for the rest of the year. I really believe that first attempt of the season scared him for the rest of the year. We have all watched him. It's known that he doesnt have the strongest arm. And that he can't throw bullets all over the field.

BUT

You do NOT need to have a cannon to be good in Spurrier's offense. All you have to do is throw the ball. It really is that simple. And I don't think shaw believes in his arm enough. Or his instincts to run kick in. Or both. He trust his legs more than he trust his arm. But either way he has a big problem. I hope he can get over the hump.

Dylan Thompson:
Nice arm. Not elite by any means. But can put some zip on it.
Likes to throw. He wants to bomb it all over.
Fast learner. He has improved so much, so fast.

Inexperienced. Only has two starts.

To be honest before this season I never thought much about DT. Even after his first start I wasn't sure about him. But I liked that he liked to throw. And he could put some nice zip on the ball.

I was very nervous when I heard he was to start at Clemson. But man he blew me away. Did what he was told. Threw the ball when a pass play was called. We finally had a QB playing like a QB. He threw nfl types of throws. The back shoulder throw in the Endzone. The two rockets threw double coverage perfectly placed in justices hands that he dropped. It was so refreshing to see Spurrier's offense ran like its supposed to be run.

He coulda had a few passes picked. But hey so could have every QB. Look at Shaw for example. Aganst UGA. Under threw two passes badly and they were picked off but our guys snatched the ball out of their hands. Happens to everyone.

We all watch the games. The offense runs better under Dylan. And that's just a fact. If believe if shaw would actually throw he could run it like that. Even with the weaker arm.

I do like that DT went into a hostile stadium and played a great game.

[Cocky2001]

Originally Posted by pantera17

Okay. Let's look at what we know. From what we as gamecock fans have seen through Connor and Dylan's careers. Now everyone that watches gamecock football has seen these. So we all know them to be true.

Connor Shaw:
Great athlete. Very fast.
Hard worker. Wants to get better.
Smart QB. Doesn't force passes.

Weak arm. There are some throws he just can't put enough on to make.

Shaw's first pass of the 2012 season was an route about 20yards down the field. Shaw couldn't get enough on the ball and it was picked off. After that we really didn't see shaw even attempt to make throws like that for the rest of the year. I really believe that first attempt of the season scared him for the rest of the year. We have all watched him. It's known that he doesnt have the strongest arm. And that he can't throw bullets all over the field.

BUT

You do NOT need to have a cannon to be good in Spurrier's offense. All you have to do is throw the ball. It really is that simple. And I don't think shaw believes in his arm enough. Or his instincts to run kick in. Or both. He trust his legs more than he trust his arm. But either way he has a big problem. I hope he can get over the hump.

Dylan Thompson:
Nice arm. Not elite by any means. But can put some zip on it.
Likes to throw. He wants to bomb it all over.
Fast learner. He has improved so much, so fast.

Inexperienced. Only has two starts.

To be honest before this season I never thought much about DT. Even after his first start I wasn't sure about him. But I liked that he liked to throw. And he could put some nice zip on the ball.

I was very nervous when I heard he was to start at Clemson. But man he blew me away. Did what he was told. Threw the ball when a pass play was called. We finally had a QB playing like a QB. He threw nfl types of throws. The back shoulder throw in the Endzone. The two rockets threw double coverage perfectly placed in justices hands that he dropped. It was so refreshing to see Spurrier's offense ran like its supposed to be run.

He coulda had a few passes picked. But hey so could have every QB. Look at Shaw for example. Aganst UGA. Under threw two passes badly and they were picked off but our guys snatched the ball out of their hands. Happens to everyone.

We all watch the games. The offense runs better under Dylan. And that's just a fact. If believe if shaw would actually throw he could run it like that. Even with the weaker arm.

I do like that DT went into a hostile stadium and played a great game.

The ones that dream of someday being Mrs Connor Shaw when he is Rookie of the Year in the NFL aren't going to like this post, argue that your facts aren't as good as their facts, and call you stupid for not bowing down in reverence to them.

But, fwiw, I think you've made excellent points and a GREAT post!

[snoopcockycock]

Originally Posted by Cocky2001

To be honest, that's not original to me...and I pretty much see it the way you state...I just threw that out there to see what the master of insight Snoop would say. I guess Snoop didn't want to post on this one...I was looking forward to what he had to say.

sorry for being late to the party, but our net was out.
so 2001, you like to stir the pot as well. and no, i don't agree with many of the points that pantera listed. for instance, which nfl throws is he writing about? i saw dylan short hop several balls on out routes. are those the ones? i saw him throw SIX balls right to the clempscum defenders. maybe those are the nfl throws he is talking about. there have been a lot of nfl qb's throwing tons of interception's this year.
next, not only does shaw not have a weak arm, but he actually has a strong arm. i'm not saying he has a cannon, but many of the announcers calling our games, have commented that shaw actually has a strong arm. plus, using some of you guys tech.'s, we've watched him make some excellent long throws last year. sos has commented several times about shaw throwing a beautiful long ball. it was one of the biggest story-lines coming out of preseason practice before the 2011 season. there were many comments about how shaw had a much more accurate long ball than garcia. so, what has changed? ooooooooooooh, i don't know, maybe a fractured scapula? maybe a fractured foot, and high ankle sprain? nah, that can't be it. what do feet have to do with throwing a ball? lol!!
come on guys. he has been injured all season long, behind an extremely young ol, who performed terribly in most games. so with injuries like that, wouldn't you be a little hesitant? and through all of that, he still went 8-2 as a starter. watch the bowl game, then we'll have something more to talk about.
and one final note for pantera. the offense doesn't run better under dylan, the offense runs better against crappy defenses. think about that for a while.

[yazoo]

Originally Posted by pantera17

Connor Shaw:

...

Weak arm. There are some throws he just can't put enough on to make.

False. Spurrier has stated several times that Connor throws a nice deep ball.

[Next Year]

Healthy Shaw > Healthy Thompson > Injured Shaw

[gripitandripit2007]

Originally Posted by pantera17

Okay. Let's look at what we know. From what we as gamecock fans have seen through Connor and Dylan's careers. Now everyone that watches gamecock football has seen these. So we all know them to be true.

Connor Shaw:
Great athlete. Very fast.
Hard worker. Wants to get better.
Smart QB. Doesn't force passes.

Weak arm. There are some throws he just can't put enough on to make.

Shaw's first pass of the 2012 season was an route about 20yards down the field. Shaw couldn't get enough on the ball and it was picked off. After that we really didn't see shaw even attempt to make throws like that for the rest of the year. I really believe that first attempt of the season scared him for the rest of the year. We have all watched him. It's known that he doesnt have the strongest arm. And that he can't throw bullets all over the field.

BUT

You do NOT need to have a cannon to be good in Spurrier's offense. All you have to do is throw the ball. It really is that simple. And I don't think shaw believes in his arm enough. Or his instincts to run kick in. Or both. He trust his legs more than he trust his arm. But either way he has a big problem. I hope he can get over the hump.

Dylan Thompson:
Nice arm. Not elite by any means. But can put some zip on it.
Likes to throw. He wants to bomb it all over.
Fast learner. He has improved so much, so fast.

Inexperienced. Only has two starts.

To be honest before this season I never thought much about DT. Even after his first start I wasn't sure about him. But I liked that he liked to throw. And he could put some nice zip on the ball.

I was very nervous when I heard he was to start at Clemson. But man he blew me away. Did what he was told. Threw the ball when a pass play was called. We finally had a QB playing like a QB. He threw nfl types of throws. The back shoulder throw in the Endzone. The two rockets threw double coverage perfectly placed in justices hands that he dropped. It was so refreshing to see Spurrier's offense ran like its supposed to be run.

He coulda had a few passes picked. But hey so could have every QB. Look at Shaw for example. Aganst UGA. Under threw two passes badly and they were picked off but our guys snatched the ball out of their hands. Happens to everyone.

We all watch the games. The offense runs better under Dylan. And that's just a fact. If believe if shaw would actually throw he could run it like that. Even with the weaker arm.

I do like that DT went into a hostile stadium and played a great game.

There are opinions...then there are facts...you gave your opinions...now...here are the facts...

Connor Shaw:
Hurt for over 90% of the year
Even though injured...and even playing against MUCH tougher defenses finished 12th IN THE COUNTRY in QB rating of 156.9
Best game he threw for 356 yards & 3 TDs

Dylan Thompson:
Healthy for over 90% of the year
Even though healthy...and even playing against MUCH weaker defenses finished 60th IN THE COUNTRY in QB rating of 134.9
Best game he threw for 330 yards & 3 TDs

A lot more facts are available if needed if this isn't enough

[pantera17]

Originally Posted by yazoo

False. Spurrier has stated several times that Connor throws a nice deep ball.

Something that needs to be cleared up. Everyone needs to know this.

Arm strength is measured in velocity not distance. Something all the great QBs have said many times. Velocity over distance everyday.

And yes I remember when spurrier said that. It was last off season correct? This season shaw didn't throw very many good deep throws. They were almost all underthrown.

But he threw nice ones in 2011. So it's possible his injury was the cause.

[SimpleGamecock]

Originally Posted by gripitandripit2007

There are opinions...then there are facts...you gave your opinions...now...here are the facts...

Connor Shaw:
Hurt for over 90% of the year
Even though injured...and even playing against MUCH tougher defenses finished 12th IN THE COUNTRY in QB rating of 156.9
Best game he threw for 356 yards & 3 TDs

Dylan Thompson:
Healthy for over 90% of the year
Even though healthy...and even playing against MUCH weaker defenses finished 60th IN THE COUNTRY in QB rating of 134.9
Best game he threw for 330 yards & 3 TDs

A lot more facts are available if needed if this isn't enough

Where are you getting this MUCH weaker defense information? Connor's best passing day was against UT which is the 113th worst passing defense in the nation. Dylan's was against ECU which is 110th, still not good but on par with Tennessee. And if you take a look at the games Connor played against a Top 50 passing defense GA, LSU, Florida he has struggled with the exception of Georiga (where he was only 6-10). I know LSU & Florida were on the road but in order to take the next step we need to win those games. If we beat Florida we are in Atlanta with a chance at the National Championship. And as was pointed out earlier Connor's 3 losses have all been on the road. He was hurt and I respect him for playing through the pain I really do but my hope is when he comes back healthy he can run the offense utilizing the talent around him and not tuck and run as much because Dylan has shown that when we have a QB that will stand in the pocket and deliver the ball we have the chance to be special on offense.

[CoverTwo]

Regardless what side of the fence you are on, there is no question there were some throws in that game that Connor can't make or hasn't shown the ability to make.

For example, the deep square in to Nick Jones where Jones was actually the 3rd option. The td to ace would be another. Both were frozen ropes between defenders. Then of course the back shoulder. This is what you get with Thompson. Higher risk but higher reward.

As fans it's just what style you prefer. Can't go wrong with either.

[Dizzy01]

Originally Posted by pantera17

Something that needs to be cleared up. Everyone needs to know this.

Arm strength is measured in velocity not distance. Something all the great QBs have said many times. Velocity over distance everyday.

And yes I remember when spurrier said that. It was last off season correct? This season shaw didn't throw very many good deep throws. They were almost all underthrown.

But he threw nice ones in 2011. So it's possible his injury was the cause.

If velocity is the most important factor for a QB why did Jeff George and Ryan Leaf crap out but Drew Brees and Trent Dilfer won Superbowls?

[pantera17]

Originally Posted by Dizzy01

If velocity is the most important factor for a QB why did Jeff George and Ryan Leaf crap out but Drew Brees and Trent Dilfer won Superbowls?

When did i say that?

All i was saying is when someone says arm stregth they need to be thinkong velocity

[gripitandripit2007]

Originally Posted by SimpleGamecock

Where are you getting this MUCH weaker defense information? Connor's best passing day was against UT which is the 113th worst passing defense in the nation. Dylan's was against ECU which is 110th, still not good but on par with Tennessee. And if you take a look at the games Connor played against a Top 50 passing defense GA, LSU, Florida he has struggled with the exception of Georiga (where he was only 6-10). I know LSU & Florida were on the road but in order to take the next step we need to win those games. If we beat Florida we are in Atlanta with a chance at the National Championship. And as was pointed out earlier Connor's 3 losses have all been on the road. He was hurt and I respect him for playing through the pain I really do but my hope is when he comes back healthy he can run the offense utilizing the talent around him and not tuck and run as much because Dylan has shown that when we have a QB that will stand in the pocket and deliver the ball we have the chance to be special on offense.

I'm talking OVERALL...Connors QBR is higher against ALL teams he faced...Vandy, Tenn, Georgia, Fla, LSU, etc. The teams he faced overall were "MUCH" better D's than the few bad ones Dylan faced. As for us beating top teams...it takes more than just a QB to win. Great D's shut down good QB's more often than not...look what the heisman winner did against LSU & Florida. They lost against 2 good defensive teams to keep them out of the SEC too...but their fans don't blame Manziel for it...so why are ours? And Connor has shown that "when we have a QB that will stand in the pocket & deliver the ball we have a chance to be a special offense" also against bad D's...see Tennessee game

[gripitandripit2007]

Originally Posted by CoverTwo

Regardless what side of the fence you are on, there is no question there were some throws in that game that Connor can't make or hasn't shown the ability to make.

For example, the deep square in to Nick Jones where Jones was actually the 3rd option. The td to ace would be another. Both were frozen ropes between defenders. Then of course the back shoulder. This is what you get with Thompson. Higher risk but higher reward.

As fans it's just what style you prefer. Can't go wrong with either.

I would rather have the safe QB...high risk does equal higher reward...but I would much rather have someone that throws less pics....they destroy games

[gripitandripit2007]

Originally Posted by Dizzy01

If velocity is the most important factor for a QB why did Jeff George and Ryan Leaf crap out but Drew Brees and Trent Dilfer won Superbowls?

Exactly!!!

Jamarcus Russell was another example.
Peyton Manning don't have a "gun" like other QBs do...but I will take Peyton's accuracy over velocity an day!

[Nureye]

I think this thread is based on one major fallacy. That Clemson is a good football team.

Clemson is not good at playing football.

Therefore, Dylan should get credit for beating a very average football program. The rest is inconsequential.

[cockybusiness2]

I took time to read the entire thread... Then ...LMAO... I remember when I got bashed for calling for Garcia... I probabaly deserved it. Both SHAW AND THOMPSON ARE GOOD NOT GREAT qb's. EACH HAS HIS OWN SKILL SET...

But let me ask the Shaw bashers... Would we have beated Vandy without Shaw

[cockybusiness2]

Excuse my yelling my cap lock got stuck