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Old 01-04-2013, 03:54 PM   #201
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

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Originally Posted by gripitandripit2007 View Post
I have explained several times that my opinion is based on facts...so when someone says my opinion is wrong...I show stats and show why I think the way I do...if I think someone's opinion is wrong...I have no problem coming out and saying it....but I haven't. When I use facts....I am talking about stats...and that is not opinions...opinions is who we THINK is better...each is entitled to their own opinion...but when someone says Dylan has outplayed Connor or is more accurate,etc...I show stats that show why I disagree...or I show stats to take up for our QB that a lot of people bash. And here ya go again making up stuff...I have never said Dylan hasn't shown anything...please show me if u think I did. I have simply said that he hasn't PROVEN as much as Connor and against good D's until this past weekend. Again...this thread isn't about u & me...if u or anybody else has a problem with me...PM me and we will talk...or if u want to meet in person...I will meet u somewhere to talk...but let's leave what's left to this thread to be just Connor and Dylan
You really don't see how your posts can rub people the wrong way? You present your opinions as better than others. I understand that you have stats that "back up" your opinions, but you fail to aknowledge that stats are only some of the overall picture. There is no way to show how a whole offseason as number 1 QB made effected the stats. There is no way to tell what would happen if Shaw went in cold with no preparation the week before. There's no way to control the stats over different opponents. You can throw out the defensive stats to say who's played harder teams, but matchups matter a fair deal. The flow of the individual game effects the stats for that game. Stats are not an absolute. We're all speculating about what may happen. No one knows who is going to be a better, but you constantly act like you are right and others a wrong.
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Old 01-04-2013, 04:08 PM   #202
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

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Originally Posted by klempsux View Post
You really don't see how your posts can rub people the wrong way? You present your opinions as better than others. I understand that you have stats that "back up" your opinions, but you fail to aknowledge that stats are only some of the overall picture. There is no way to show how a whole offseason as number 1 QB made effected the stats. There is no way to tell what would happen if Shaw went in cold with no preparation the week before. There's no way to control the stats over different opponents. You can throw out the defensive stats to say who's played harder teams, but matchups matter a fair deal. The flow of the individual game effects the stats for that game. Stats are not an absolute. We're all speculating about what may happen. No one knows who is going to be a better, but you constantly act like you are right and others a wrong.
Like I have said before...I don't even use stats most of the time until someone downs my opinion or says my opinion is wrong. Again...I know the stats don't show everything mentioned above...but it shows what happened and the fact of what happened and there is no arguing that. Again...I think the confusion comes when I say in my OPINION Connor is better and should be the starter bc he deserves it and has done a lot the past 2 years and PROVEN more...but others have other opinions and to each their own...but the stats that I mention...the comparable stats that show comp %, yards, TD's, and QB rating are facts. I think some get confused with what I am saying....not saying Connor is better is a fact and everyone else is wrong...just saying that the stats that each has put up...that Connor has the better stats...that is the fact...see where the confusion is?
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Old 01-04-2013, 04:22 PM   #203
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

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Like I have said before...I don't even use stats most of the time until someone downs my opinion or says my opinion is wrong. Again...I know the stats don't show everything mentioned above...but it shows what happened and the fact of what happened and there is no arguing that. Again...I think the confusion comes when I say in my OPINION Connor is better and should be the starter bc he deserves it and has done a lot the past 2 years and PROVEN more...but others have other opinions and to each their own...but the stats that I mention...the comparable stats that show comp %, yards, TD's, and QB rating are facts. I think some get confused with what I am saying....not saying Connor is better is a fact and everyone else is wrong...just saying that the stats that each has put up...that Connor has the better stats...that is the fact...see where the confusion is?
I'm done. You're just going to keep talking in circles.
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Old 01-04-2013, 04:24 PM   #204
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

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I'm done. You're just going to keep talking in circles.
Sorry u feel that way & can't see what I'm saying...but the being done things sounds good to me!
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Old 01-04-2013, 05:07 PM   #205
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

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Sorry u feel that way & can't see what I'm saying...but the being done things sounds good to me!
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Old 01-04-2013, 05:18 PM   #206
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

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Kane, so I want to ask you a question. This is an honest question. I don't mean it as a slam. I am trying to understand better because there is a part out of all of this that confuses me. It is the part I keep getting stuck on.

Let me preface by saying, as I have already said, that I don't have a preference for one QB over the other. Whoever Spurrier says should start should start and they both deserve a chance.

But you say that someone posting "there is no way that Dylan was outplayed" is wrong because it is stated as a fact and not an opinion.

So what if someone posted "there is no way that Connor was outplayed?" Exact same statement, but stating that Dylan didn't outplay Connor. Would you think that was also someone stating an opinion as a fact and equally "wrong?"

I really am curious as to your opinion because it is the part I am struggling with throughout these threads. It seems that one "camp" of people thinks that they are just posting "facts" about their QB when something is said and everything else is an "opinion" or "inflated" about the other guy. Then the other camp does the same thing about the other guy.

To me, I see this because I am not in either of their camps. I am in Steve Spurrier's camp and I know he will make the best decision. To be honest, with my untrained eye, they seem neck and neck to me.... with both of them being EXCELLENT QBs!
I think you're getting some elements of this confused; Grip is saying "I don't like being told my opinion is wrong" (his words) when all he does on here is tell people (sometimes w/ stats that skew or spin in favor of his argument, sometimes that do actually aide his argument) that their particular opinion is wrong, something he himself has stated he does not care for.

I'm not finding fault w/ his right to his opinion. I'm pointing out the contradiction in saying "I don't like being told my opinion is wrong" when all he's DOING is telling people that their opinion, counter to his, is wrong. Does that make sense?
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Old 01-04-2013, 05:52 PM   #207
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

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I think you're getting some elements of this confused; Grip is saying "I don't like being told my opinion is wrong" (his words) when all he does on here is tell people (sometimes w/ stats that skew or spin in favor of his argument, sometimes that do actually aide his argument) that their particular opinion is wrong, something he himself has stated he does not care for.

I'm not finding fault w/ his right to his opinion. I'm pointing out the contradiction in saying "I don't like being told my opinion is wrong" when all he's DOING is telling people that their opinion, counter to his, is wrong. Does that make sense?
Again Kane...I don't mean to come out to tell anyone their opinion is wrong...I just tell my side and my opinion...and sometimes back them up with stats...which are facts...it is merely to prove my point...not to say anyone is wrong for their opinion...and to clear this up...it's not so much me not LIKING if someone says I'm wrong...that's just when I usually pull the stats to prove that I am not.
Again...I have never intended on saying or insinuating that someone is wrong for saying Dylan is better and is their favorite QB...but when someone starts stating false things and bashing Connor that I pull facts to show its not true. I hope u and everyone can see the difference
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Old 01-04-2013, 05:53 PM   #208
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

Does anyone else see the small amount of irony that this thread was started on the premise of something ending, but this topic seems to be one that will continue for a long, long time?
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Old 01-04-2013, 06:07 PM   #209
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

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Again Kane...I don't mean to come out to tell anyone their opinion is wrong...I just tell my side and my opinion...and sometimes back them up with stats...which are facts...it is merely to prove my point...not to say anyone is wrong for their opinion...and to clear this up...it's not so much me not LIKING if someone says I'm wrong...that's just when I usually pull the stats to prove that I am not.
Again...I have never intended on saying or insinuating that someone is wrong for saying Dylan is better and is their favorite QB...but when someone starts stating false things and bashing Connor that I pull facts to show its not true. I hope u and everyone can see the difference
I hear you. I was just going off of you saying "I don't like being told my opinion is wrong". That was the direct quote I was responding to.
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Old 01-04-2013, 06:28 PM   #210
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

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I hear you. I was just going off of you saying "I don't like being told my opinion is wrong". That was the direct quote I was responding to.
I understand...but who does? Nobody likes that but if someone does I usually have stats to back them up and a lot of people take that the wrong way sometimes bc my opinion has facts to back mine up and theirs don't. I love to debate and argue sports...some can take it and some can't
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Old 01-05-2013, 11:13 PM   #211
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

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Maybe you should coach the team, that Spurrier guy obviously doesn't have the insight you do about football.


See how dumb that sounds?


Is that necessary? All I did was express my opinion. I didn't denigrate anyone. Do you realize how dumb you sound? Pathetic.
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Old 01-05-2013, 11:19 PM   #212
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

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Don't understand this logic at all...nobody can predict the future or try to determine how he WOULD HAVE done if he would have played more. I bet if Connor would have gotten taken out after the first drive...and Dylan came in to play the rest of the game...you could say the same about Connor. That's the same as saying if Seth Strickland would have played more this year he would have more TDs than both QBs bc he has only attempted 6 passes and 1 was a TD...so does that mean every 6 throws is gonna be a TD? Come on guys....don't you think if our offense was more efficient with Dylan he would have started every game this year?!
I'm going by what my eyes told me and what I posted is what my eyes saw. Shaw wasted drives, Dylan none. Sorry if that is hard for you to comprehend.
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Old 01-06-2013, 10:20 AM   #213
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

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I'm going by what my eyes told me and what I posted is what my eyes saw. Shaw wasted drives, Dylan none. Sorry if that is hard for you to comprehend.
Not at all hard to comprehend...just don't agree with it. Maybe I am being too literal...but Shaw don't waste drives by himself...but if u meant some of our drives stalled more with Connor in more than Dylan...I would agree with that. Would I blame them all on Connor? No! But the part that I said that I didn't understand the logic on is taking the stats that a player did for 3 or 4 series and stretch them and multiply them and say "this WOULD HAVE been his total"...nobody can predict that. But both played great and it took both to win...looking forward to what next year holds at the QB position!
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Old 01-06-2013, 10:57 AM   #214
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

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Is that necessary? All I did was express my opinion. I didn't denigrate anyone. Do you realize how dumb you sound? Pathetic.
Just when we thought this thread was over...

Yes, it was necessary, here is your original post:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rebel4ever View Post
Shaw played well and made some keys passes. That said, if Dylan started and played the whole game, we'd have beat Michigan by 17-20 points. He shredded their defense the little time he played. Shaw had at least 4-5 wasted drives. Dylan none. Our offense is better and more efficient with Dylan leading.
You didn't denigrate anyone, except Shaw, and Spurrier, and the entire coaching staff. What exactly do you think it says of our coaches that we could have won by 17-20 points, as you put it, but instead decided to play people that were not as good. I never called you stupid, just what you said, because it was. I say dumb stuff sometimes too, but just think about the implications of what you are actually saying here. How bad of a staff do you have to be to have the opportunity to win by 20 just by playing the "right qb" but choose otherwise.

Sorry if you got offended, but to me people on Cockytalk thinking they know more about football than Spurrier and his staff is what's pathetic. If you want to profess an opinion that Dylan is a better qb that's one thing, saying he should be the starter and estimating a point differential had he played is another.
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Old 01-06-2013, 04:17 PM   #215
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

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Does anyone else see the small amount of irony that this thread was started on the premise of something ending, but this topic seems to be one that will continue for a long, long time?
I'm not exactly helping but.....
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Old 01-06-2013, 06:50 PM   #216
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

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Just when we thought this thread was over...

Yes, it was necessary, here is your original post:



You didn't denigrate anyone, except Shaw, and Spurrier, and the entire coaching staff. What exactly do you think it says of our coaches that we could have won by 17-20 points, as you put it, but instead decided to play people that were not as good. I never called you stupid, just what you said, because it was. I say dumb stuff sometimes too, but just think about the implications of what you are actually saying here. How bad of a staff do you have to be to have the opportunity to win by 20 just by playing the "right qb" but choose otherwise.

Sorry if you got offended, but to me people on Cockytalk thinking they know more about football than Spurrier and his staff is what's pathetic. If you want to profess an opinion that Dylan is a better qb that's one thing, saying he should be the starter and estimating a point differential had he played is another.
God. Its like we're not allowed to discuss football on a football message board.
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Old 01-06-2013, 07:11 PM   #217
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

Thanks for derailing my post, guys!!!

Jeez!

Just take it ouside, for crying out loud!

The original point of this thread was to state that those that say Dylan has never had to perform under pressure against a quality defense can now stop making that inane argument.

Nothing more.
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Old 01-06-2013, 07:19 PM   #218
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

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God. Its like we're not allowed to discuss football on a football message board.
Who is stopping you? Say whatever you want. If someone thinks your opinion is dumb, then shows you why, just don't whine about it.
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Old 01-06-2013, 07:24 PM   #219
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

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Originally Posted by trapper82 View Post
Who is stopping you? Say whatever you want. If someone thinks your opinion is dumb, then shows you why, just don't whine about it.
Right. And when someone actually shows me why "my opinion is dumb" outside of "YOURE NOT COACHES" I'll keep that in mind.

But if someone does dare say "CS should be starter" or "DT should be starter" we can all count on Trapper82 to tell us what we're allowed to discuss.
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Old 01-06-2013, 07:34 PM   #220
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Default Re: One Argument is Now Ended

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Originally Posted by KaneisAble View Post
Right. And when someone actually shows me why "my opinion is dumb" outside of "YOURE NOT COACHES" I'll keep that in mind.

But if someone does dare say "CS should be starter" or "DT should be starter" we can all count on Trapper82 to tell us what we're allowed to discuss.
Apparently you believe I have some power to allow discussion or shut it down. I appreciate that you think so much of me, I really do. I am just another guy giving his opinion, that's all.

But since you are here, answer the question I posed to another poster: "what does it say about our coaches that we could have won by 17 or 20 points if we had played Dylan Thompson." You didn't make that statement, but since you've obviously decided to agree with the guy I was addressing please share.
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