Quality of SEC offensive execution

[USCNowAndForever]

Originally Posted by Cocks and Canes

This post doesn't even merit a response because when you look through the OP's history he is at best a miserable fan who thinks he can do a much better job than our coaches and at worst a tater. Just one example:

http://www.cockytalk.com/showthread....54#post3565354

But I'll respond anyway.

09 SEC Championship:

-Terrance Cody was a nose tackle, it's not really surprising that he missed a block against the team that won the national title that year

-Tebow threw a bad pass? Holy shit, that's something I've never seen before.

2012 USC-LSU:

Our TEs were by far our most effective players that game, I guess you don't remember Justice's long catch and Adams' late catch over the middle that set up our final TD.

2012 USC-UF:

Our entire offense didn't show up to this game

2012 SEC Championship:

Last play of the game, hurrying to the line, and a backup running back misses a blocking assignment? That entire sequence was a cluster**** because UGA panicked, not because of any deficiency among SEC offenses.


I get the feeling this thread was created by someone who is jealous of the SEC's success and buys into the myth that the only reason SEC defense are good is because the offenses are bad, despite SEC teams routinely dominating teams from other conferences on both sides of the ball.

Concerning what you said about Terrence Cody, I will go back to my point about the level of coaching. What you said is true, which is exactly why he never should have been in on that play. Why risk injuring one of your most important defensive players on offense when you are only going to use him for a few plays, and if you are not even sure if he can block properly? How many reps did he get with that play? I am guessing probably not that many considering that his primary job was on defense. You can't just pull a guy over from defense, give him a few reps at a new position, and expect him to play excellently at that new position on a consistent basis.

It's not just that he threw a bad pass, he threw the complete opposite type of pass from what he needed to throw in that situation. Hernandez was wide open behind the defense, and yet Tebow throws the pass straight to the defense instead of lofting it over them. Considering how complicated Florida's offense was under Urban Meyer, and extensive their running game was, how many reps do you think he had with that pass play? Probably not many.

USC's TEs made great plays against LSU. So what? Wes Welker made great plays in 2007. Randy Moss made great plays in 2007. Tom Brady made great plays in 2007. But at the end of the season, their offense collapsed against the Giants. It has also collapsed almost every season since then in the post-season.

Concerning what you said about the 2012 USC-UF game, that does not really help your case. I pointed out the receivers colliding on the Seam/In route combination because that is the error play for that game that stood out to me. I think the main reason it stood out to me is because it is an example of routes not being ran properly, which because of players not having enough reps with each play. That ultimately falls back on the coaches. As I pointed out in another post in this thread, Louisiana Tech has greatly simplified their offense and it has worked well for them. It was against WAC defenses, but the point is that their level of offensive performance was high. They generally did not beat themselves on offense, unlike USC under Spurrier.

I am not suggesting that we hire Tony Franklin, but rather suggesting that there is a better way than the way Spurrier has used thus far.

Concerning what you said about the 2012 SEC Championship game, that also does not help your case. Pressure situations like the end of the 2012 SEC Championship game are exactly why it is so important for players to know how to do their jobs correctly, and have the reps doing their job correctly. If UGA had practiced that sort of situation, do you think they would have panicked? If they did practice it, did they get enough reps?

I am a USC fan, and an SEC fan. I think it is awesome that the SEC keeps on winning one national title after another, as well as generally dominating outside the conference. I don't think SEC defenses are great because the offenses are bad, it's just that the offenses could be so much better if they did not defeat themselves so often. If they have a great offense, do their jobs correctly, and the defense still outplays them, that's just football. But when you beat yourself because you have players who don't understand their assignments, players who start freelancing, and players who don't have enough experience running plays because your offense is too multiple and complicated, maybe you need to look at simplifying the playbook.

[GamecockSuperFan]

Read the last 2 posts of page 1. Then type up another novel.

[USCNowAndForever]

Originally Posted by GamecockSuperFan

Read the last 2 posts of page 1.

I did.

I think it is ironic that you said I sound like an NCAA arm-chair quarterback when you are the one with NCAA 13 in your signature...lol.

[GamecockSuperFan]

I think it's ironic that's all you took away from my post but alright.

[USCNowAndForever]

Originally Posted by GamecockSuperFan

I get what your saying about simplicity but no coach in america has 20 different ways of beating cover 3 like your saying. I mean..there's only a few route concepts to go about beating a certain coverage.

I think you might be the one who does not understand football.

Potential Cover 3 beater route concepts:

1. All Hitches

2. 4 Verticals

3. Curl Flat

4. 2 man Snag

5. 3 man Snag

6. Mesh (with receivers adjusting and settling in weak spots between the coverage)

7. Texas (Granted this is often used against "Tampa 2", which is a semi-Cover 3 defense)

8. Switch (With inside receiver settling between deep defender and flat defender, and outside receiver attacking the seam)

9. Stick

10. Shallow Cross (With one inside receiver settling in the weak spot between zones)

11. Go/Hitch (Outside receiver runs a go, inside receiver runs a hitch, which puts the flat defender in conflict)

12. In/Seam

I can put up more if you would like for me to.

[GamecockSuperFan]

Let it go man. You pinpointed the one single thing in my post that you could find a way show your know it all-ness about. I know what i'm talking about but i'm not going to defend myself with a long post. I figured I would contribute to your thread but i'm out lol.

[Cock Kool-Aid]

This thread is an abomination...

NowandForever... get a life, dude.

[qcgamecock]

Originally Posted by USCNowAndForever

Watching some past SEC games, it is interesting to me how often SEC teams fail to execute offensive plays correctly.

Examples:

2009 SEC Championship game

-Mark Ingram runs the ball to the right down on the goal line with Terrence Cody lead blocking. Cody barely makes the block and flies into the endzone and almost falls flat on his face.

-Tebow has Hernandez wide open behind the defense in the upper right corner of the endzone, and yet Tebow tries to throw more of a bullet pass and it is intercepted by Javier Arenas.

2012 USC-LSU game

-I have covered this one several times on here before, but USC's TEs fail to execute the Mesh play correctly.

2012 USC-UF game

-I have also covered this one several times on here before. USC's two right receivers run into each other while trying to run a Seam/In route combination.

2012 SEC Championship game

-UGA's running back fails to pass protect correctly, which leads to a Bama linebacker tipping Aaron Murray's pass.

These are just a few examples.

No one is perfect, but considering how well the SEC is known for football, not to mention the quality of coaching, how is this sort of stuff so commonplace in the SEC? Perhaps SEC teams tend to be so good at defense that there is no incentive for them to be better at offense?

Keep in mind that these sort of errors are usually not because of something the defense did, but rather they are execution errors where the offense beat themselves, especially with USC's TEs and WRs not running plays correctly.

This is not an SEC thing this is a human thing, we make mistakes and if you put 22 of us on a field they will make them together. If we find a sports team that executes close to perfection the become Champions and even they are human and make execution errors, see the Super Bowl, NCAA Tourney, heck any sporting event and you will see.... That is like asking how di Michael Jordan ever miss a shot or dunk or free throw or throw the ball away or lose a game... Oh yeah most of them are under 20 year old as well, pressure will make you do strange things and lose your mind!

[qcgamecock]

Originally Posted by USCNowAndForever

Concerning what you said about Terrence Cody, I will go back to my point about the level of coaching. What you said is true, which is exactly why he never should have been in on that play. Why risk injuring one of your most important defensive players on offense when you are only going to use him for a few plays, and if you are not even sure if he can block properly? How many reps did he get with that play? I am guessing probably not that many considering that his primary job was on defense. You can't just pull a guy over from defense, give him a few reps at a new position, and expect him to play excellently at that new position on a consistent basis.

It's not just that he threw a bad pass, he threw the complete opposite type of pass from what he needed to throw in that situation. Hernandez was wide open behind the defense, and yet Tebow throws the pass straight to the defense instead of lofting it over them. Considering how complicated Florida's offense was under Urban Meyer, and extensive their running game was, how many reps do you think he had with that pass play? Probably not many.

USC's TEs made great plays against LSU. So what? Wes Welker made great plays in 2007. Randy Moss made great plays in 2007. Tom Brady made great plays in 2007. But at the end of the season, their offense collapsed against the Giants. It has also collapsed almost every season since then in the post-season.

Concerning what you said about the 2012 USC-UF game, that does not really help your case. I pointed out the receivers colliding on the Seam/In route combination because that is the error play for that game that stood out to me. I think the main reason it stood out to me is because it is an example of routes not being ran properly, which because of players not having enough reps with each play. That ultimately falls back on the coaches. As I pointed out in another post in this thread, Louisiana Tech has greatly simplified their offense and it has worked well for them. It was against WAC defenses, but the point is that their level of offensive performance was high. They generally did not beat themselves on offense, unlike USC under Spurrier.

I am not suggesting that we hire Tony Franklin, but rather suggesting that there is a better way than the way Spurrier has used thus far.

Concerning what you said about the 2012 SEC Championship game, that also does not help your case. Pressure situations like the end of the 2012 SEC Championship game are exactly why it is so important for players to know how to do their jobs correctly, and have the reps doing their job correctly. If UGA had practiced that sort of situation, do you think they would have panicked? If they did practice it, did they get enough reps?

I am a USC fan, and an SEC fan. I think it is awesome that the SEC keeps on winning one national title after another, as well as generally dominating outside the conference. I don't think SEC defenses are great because the offenses are bad, it's just that the offenses could be so much better if they did not defeat themselves so often. If they have a great offense, do their jobs correctly, and the defense still outplays them, that's just football. But when you beat yourself because you have players who don't understand their assignments, players who start freelancing, and players who don't have enough experience running plays because your offense is too multiple and complicated, maybe you need to look at simplifying the playbook.

LMAO, your card should be revoked for saying "They generally did not beat themselves on offense, unlike USC under Spurrier."!
Yeah, it is the over complicated playbook causing all these humans to make mistakes. I have been the QB in a Triple option system, very simple for everyone but complicated for the OL at times. We could execute the play perfectly but react to a defensive player differently and make a mistake even though we ran the same play over and over and over and over with different outcomes due to the defense, you know the other 11 guys on the field who are there to disrupt your execution.
I was also the QB for a pro set offense and very complicated play book compared to the triple option. Within this playbook were several read routes that on 95% of times I read the same as the WR but there was that 5%. On max protect plays the RB was not assigned anyone to block but to assist on the first man through, many times on film it would appear he had no clue what he was doing because he had to make a snap decision on who to block within a split second if more than one man got through. We executed most plays pretty well at the snap, but one man gets beat and now we are making quick decisions, an OL getting meat off the ball is not poor execution but the snap decisions made to keep the play going lead to mistakes that could look like poor execution since pro set offenses have many plays that require time unlike the triple option.
I have been upset a few times over execution to get back to the line and get a played called but the examples you use are players making decisions not execution, there is a reason great coaches have great players.

[USCNowAndForever]

Originally Posted by qcgamecock

LMAO, your card should be revoked for saying "They generally did not beat themselves on offense, unlike USC under Spurrier."!
Yeah, it is the over complicated playbook causing all these humans to make mistakes. I have been the QB in a Triple option system, very simple for everyone but complicated for the OL at times. We could execute the play perfectly but react to a defensive player differently and make a mistake even though we ran the same play over and over and over and over with different outcomes due to the defense, you know the other 11 guys on the field who are there to disrupt your execution.
I was also the QB for a pro set offense and very complicated play book compared to the triple option. Within this playbook were several read routes that on 95% of times I read the same as the WR but there was that 5%. On max protect plays the RB was not assigned anyone to block but to assist on the first man through, many times on film it would appear he had no clue what he was doing because he had to make a snap decision on who to block within a split second if more than one man got through. We executed most plays pretty well at the snap, but one man gets beat and now we are making quick decisions, an OL getting meat off the ball is not poor execution but the snap decisions made to keep the play going lead to mistakes that could look like poor execution since pro set offenses have many plays that require time unlike the triple option.
I have been upset a few times over execution to get back to the line and get a played called but the examples you use are players making decisions not execution, there is a reason great coaches have great players.

All of what you said is true, but the plays that I listed were examples of players messing up on their own without the defense doing anything.

The Mesh play against LSU? The TEs ran into each other...If they had practiced that play enough, that should not have happened that far into the season. Then not only that, one of the TEs kept running a crossing route despite the fact that LSU was in zone coverage. When you run the Mesh play and the defense is in zone coverage, you are supposed to settle in the first "window" between defenders after meshing with the other player running a crossing route.

Tebow's pass? Hernandez had the defense beat, and Tebow threw the ball straight to the defense. It was not anything that the defense did. UF had Bama beat on that play, and at that point in the game, a touchdown and PAT would have made it a 12 point game.

The receivers running to each other while running the In/Seam route combination? They ran into each other. If they had practiced that route combination enough, that should have not happened that late into the season.

Terrence Cody missing the block? He absolutely missed the block. It was not because of anything Will Hill did. Cody had no business even being on offense in the first place. Even if you are going to use him offense, he had better make it worth the risk of injury. That was a simple execution error. Usually execution errors come from insufficient understanding of assignments and/or an insufficient amount of reps with assignments.

The running back missing the block? You make a good point about the pro set offense, but that was not the case with UGA's running back. He started to make the block on the LB, but then failed to carry out the assignment correctly.

http://coachhoover.blogspot.com/2012...onship-rb.html

"Fundamentals of RB Pass Protection

1. Scan the Defense.
Check. The RB scanned the defense and knew who to block.

2. Step with Inside Foot First.
Check.The RB stepped first with his inside foot to get inside leverage and to get his body turned correctly.

3. Close Space Quickly.
Big mistake here. Both the RB and the LB started off 5 yards from the LOS (line of scrimmage), so theoretically they should meet halfway—at or near the LOS. Instead of expanding the pocket to give room for the QB to throw, the pocket is condensed.

4. Punch.
Even with the mistake of the RB not closing the space quickly, he can still do his job and block his man if he punches him at all. Instead, the defender takes off at the 11-yard line and continues in the air relatively unimpeded and tips the ball at the 13-yard line.

5. Expand the Pocket.
After the punch, the RB should continue to force the defender outside to expand the pocket. The RB "opens up the gate" and lets the pass rusher get upfield vertically instead of widening him. On a drop-back pass that takes longer to develop, the RB would need to keep his feet working to widen the rusher and expand the pocket."

You mention the triple option offense, which is a different animal. None of the plays I mentioned involved triple option offenses, or even triple option plays. There is definitely going to be some errors because you are having to read the reactions of defenders much more often, not to mention the fact that the QB may have to make up to 3 different decisions in rapid succession on a given play.

That said, triple option offenses tend to be known for excellent fundamentals because they focus on running a limited number of concepts well. If a coach is doing their job, then players should understand what their job is and have the practice reps necessary to execute the play almost automatically during a game. There should be no freelancing going on. If you have an assignment, stick to it, how can it get any more simple than that? If they start freelancing, either you are not teaching effectively, or they are ignoring you and playing how they want to play. If it's the former, you need to do a better job teaching. If it's the latter, bench them until they get the message.

I agree with what you said about the pro-style offense, which is one of the reasons I am not a fan of it.

I don't know if you saw in one of my other posts in this thread, but Louisiana Tech does not even involve their running back in pass protection. They run only 5 man pass protection. This increases the amount of reps that their offensive line gets with 5 man pass protection, allows the offense to be more versatile, and increases the amount of reps a running back gets with passing concepts.

From the blog Cripes! Get back to fundamentals...


We reviewed how Tech distilled their blocking of identifying multiple defensive fronts to a simple 6-man protection, packaged to an odd or even front. Fast forward two years, and gone is Roger and Louie (determining back help in protection), O-Line coach, Petey Perot, has sold-out to simplicity and has removed the back from the call (just free-release the back every down). Recognize this?



Protection is split to a 3-man zone and 2-man most-dangerous-man side. The quarterback makes the call (Rickey / Linda), so he will know where he has the least help (where the quarterback read becomes part of the protection). This is very similar to what Mike Leach was using at Texas Tech and exactly how Noel Mazzone protects in his system (though he will use a back to pick up the hot).

Source:

http://brophyfootball.blogspot.com/2...fficiency.html

As for offensive linemen getting beat off the ball, when it comes to pass protection, Louisiana Tech, as well as other teams, use what is known as Vertical Set Pass Protection (VSPP). Depending on the drop of the QB, the linemen either backpedal between 2-4 steps. What this does is force defenders to chase the offensive linemen in order to get around them and get to the QB. With traditional pass protection, if a defender beats an offensive lineman, he has a straight shot to the QB and plenty of time to get to the QB before he gets rid of the ball. With VSPP, the offensive linemen are able to buy more time for the QB by moving the potential escape point (the point at which a defender is able to get around an offensive lineman) later into the play.

Several other advantages of VSPP:

1. It allows the offensive linemen to see any stunts that are occurring in front of them and adjust accordingly rather getting beat right after the snap.

2. It gives the offensive lineman the advantage because instead of the defender attacking them with a low center of gravity, the defender is upright by the time they get to the offensive lineman.

Getting back to the line and calling plays have definitely been a problem just about every season Spurrier has been at Carolina.

Louisiana Tech generally did not have those problems under Sonny Dykes/Tony Franklin. Oregon generally did not have those problems under Chip Kelly. Texas Tech generally did not have those problems under Mike Leach.

Louisiana Tech and Texas Tech do not have the offensive talent of SEC teams. Since 2005, Oregon's recruiting classes have never ranked higher than 9th nationally.

I am sure you will bring up the fact that all of those teams played against defenses that are inferior to SEC defenses. I agree. But that is not what is being argued here. Getting back to the line and calling plays are not really affected by what the defense does. That responsibility falls on the offensive coaching staff and the offensive players.

Originally Posted by qcgamecock

the examples you use are players making decisions not execution, there is a reason great coaches have great players.

Tebow made a great decision (throw to wide open Hernandez), but he made a bad throw. The two USC TEs running into each other was not players making decisions, it was players running their routes incorrectly, which is execution. The one TE continuing to run a crossing route despite LSU being in zone coverage was decision making, but then that is on the coaches to make sure the player knows how to recognize zone coverage and adjust. If they can't run it correctly, it should be thrown out of the playbook for that season. The UGA running back failed to block the LB correctly. That was an execution error. The two USC receivers running into each other while running the In/Seam route combination was an execution error.

[Flameout12]

Originally Posted by USCNowAndForever

All of what you said is true, but the plays that I listed were examples of players messing up on their own without the defense doing anything.

The Mesh play against LSU? The TEs ran into each other...If they had practiced that play enough, that should not have happened that far into the season. Then not only that, one of the TEs kept running a crossing route despite the fact that LSU was in zone coverage. When you run the Mesh play and the defense is in zone coverage, you are supposed to settle in the first "window" between defenders after meshing with the other player running a crossing route.

Tebow's pass? Hernandez had the defense beat, and Tebow threw the ball straight to the defense. It was not anything that the defense did. UF had Bama beat on that play, and at that point in the game, a touchdown and PAT would have made it a 12 point game.

The receivers running to each other while running the In/Seam route combination? They ran into each other. If they had practiced that route combination enough, that should have not happened that late into the season.

Terrence Cody missing the block? He absolutely missed the block. It was not because of anything Will Hill did. Cody had no business even being on offense in the first place. Even if you are going to use him offense, he had better make it worth the risk of injury. That was a simple execution error. Usually execution errors come from insufficient understanding of assignments and/or an insufficient amount of reps with assignments.

The running back missing the block? You make a good point about the pro set offense, but that was not the case with UGA's running back. He started to make the block on the LB, but then failed to carry out the assignment correctly.

http://coachhoover.blogspot.com/2012...onship-rb.html

"Fundamentals of RB Pass Protection

1. Scan the Defense.
Check. The RB scanned the defense and knew who to block.

2. Step with Inside Foot First.
Check.The RB stepped first with his inside foot to get inside leverage and to get his body turned correctly.

3. Close Space Quickly.
Big mistake here. Both the RB and the LB started off 5 yards from the LOS (line of scrimmage), so theoretically they should meet halfway—at or near the LOS. Instead of expanding the pocket to give room for the QB to throw, the pocket is condensed.

4. Punch.
Even with the mistake of the RB not closing the space quickly, he can still do his job and block his man if he punches him at all. Instead, the defender takes off at the 11-yard line and continues in the air relatively unimpeded and tips the ball at the 13-yard line.

5. Expand the Pocket.
After the punch, the RB should continue to force the defender outside to expand the pocket. The RB "opens up the gate" and lets the pass rusher get upfield vertically instead of widening him. On a drop-back pass that takes longer to develop, the RB would need to keep his feet working to widen the rusher and expand the pocket."

You mention the triple option offense, which is a different animal. None of the plays I mentioned involved triple option offenses, or even triple option plays. There is definitely going to be some errors because you are having to read the reactions of defenders much more often, not to mention the fact that the QB may have to make up to 3 different decisions in rapid succession on a given play.

That said, triple option offenses tend to be known for excellent fundamentals because they focus on running a limited number of concepts well. Also, supposedly some of it is due to the fact that many collegiate triple option offenses are ran by service academies, and thus they are more disciplined, but I don't know if I buy into that. If a coach is doing their job, then players should understand what their job is and have the practice reps necessary to execute the play almost automatically during a game. There should be no free-lancing going on. If you have an assignment, stick to it, how can it get any more simple than that? If they start free-lancing, either you are not teaching effectively, or they are ignoring you and playing how they want to play. If it's the former, you need to do a better job teaching. If it's the latter, bench them until they get the message.

I agree with what you said about the pro-style offense, which is one of the reasons I am not a fan of it.

I don't know if you saw in one of my other posts in this thread, but Louisiana Tech does not even involve their running back in pass protection. They run only 5 man pass protection. This increases the amount of reps that their offense line gets with 5 man pass protection, allows the offense to be more versatile, and increases the amount of reps a running back gets with passing concepts.



We reviewed how Tech distilled their blocking of identifying multiple defensive fronts to a simple 6-man protection, packaged to an odd or even front. Fast forward two years, and gone is Roger and Louie (determining back help in protection), O-Line coach, Petey Perot, has sold-out to simplicity and has removed the back from the call (just free-release the back every down). Recognize this?



Protection is split to a 3-man zone and 2-man most-dangerous-man side. The quarterback makes the call (Rickey / Linda), so he will know where he has the least help (where the quarterback read becomes part of the protection). This is very similar to what Mike Leach was using at Texas Tech and exactly how Noel Mazzone protects in his system (though he will use a back to pick up the hot).

Source:

http://brophyfootball.blogspot.com/2...fficiency.html

As for offensive linemen getting beat off the ball, when it comes to pass protection, Louisiana Tech, as well as other teams, use what is known as Vertical Set Pass Protection (VSPP). Depending on the drop of the QB, the linemen either backpedal between 2-4 steps. What this does is force defenders to chase the offensive linemen in order to get around them and get to the QB. With traditional pass protection, if a defender beats an offensive lineman, he has a straight shot to the QB and plenty of time to get to the QB before he gets rid of the ball. With VSPP, the offensive linemen are able to buy more time for the QB by moving the potential escape point (the point at which a defender is able to get around an offensive lineman) later into the play.

Several other advantages of VSPP:

1. It allows the offensive linemen to see any stunts that are occurring in front of them and adjust accordingly rather getting beat right after the snap.

2. It gives the offensive lineman the advantage because instead of the defender attacking them with a low center of gravity, the defender is upright by the time they get to the offensive lineman.

Getting back to the line and calling plays have definitely been a problem just about every season Spurrier has been at Carolina.

Louisiana Tech generally did not have those problems under Sonny Dykes/Tony Franklin. Oregon generally did not have those problems under Chip Kelly. Texas Tech generally did not have those problems under Mike Leach.

Louisiana Tech and Texas Tech do not have the offensive talent of SEC teams. Since 2005, Oregon's recruiting classes have never ranked higher than 9th nationally.

I am sure you will bring up the fact that all of those teams played against defenses that are inferior to SEC defenses. I agree. But that is not what is being argued here. Getting back to the line and calling plays are not really affected by what the defense does. That responsibility falls on the offensive coaching staff and the offensive players.



Tebow made a great decision (throw to wide open Hernandez), but he made a bad throw. The two USC TEs running into each other was not players making decisions, it was players running their routes incorrectly, which is execution. The one TE continuing to run a crossing route despite LSU being in zone coverage was decision making, but then that is on the coaches to make sure the player knows how to recognize zone coverage and adjust. If they can't run it correctly, it should be thrown out of the playbook for that season. The UGA running back failed to block the LB correctly. That was an execution error. The two USC receivers running into each other while running the In/Seam route combination was an execution error.

We're so impressed...clearly you're a yet-to-be-discovered coaching legend of unheard of proportions.

[Acockolypse Now]

A horse is a pig that can't fly straight.

[qcgamecock]

So the TE's running into each other has nothing to do with the defense but then you say one ran a route meant for man to man not the zone? Sounds like one player making a mistake in a pressure situation. It is not how good you are when you execute but how good you are when you are bad, no matter how good you are you will be bad because there are 11 humans on the field every play.

In one sentence it is execution in another it is one of 11 people on the field making a mistake, he did not block him correctly, that is not execution that is one of 11 players not blocking their assignment correctly.

So everyone executed the play correctly but Tebow made a bad split second decision, nothing to do with execution and more to do with him reading the coverage wrong.

calling plays are not really affected by what the defense does. WHAT?
I would have already revoked your card but this statement solidifies it!

La Tech was 9-3 and they play a crappy schedule but you think they execute better than a Spurrier coached GAMECOCK squad. Talk to me after Mr. Dykes has a season in the pac 10 with cal, your execution example had 35 more penalties than the HBC!

While playing in both of the aforementioned offenses we made mistakes in execution but they were hardly ever the problem, it was a decision made after the error that caused us hardship. This is the same reason when we execute properly it was a decision made based on the defense disrupting that play that caused hardship, trying to force a throw, trying to make something out of nothing...being human.
I bet you could find as many great plays with broke down execution from the same personnel, the play is a starter blueprint, but we all know the 50% blueprint will have plenty of changes, the 100% blueprint will have more and the finished product will represent the 100% blueprints very closely but we will have to provide asbuilt drawings because even the greatest plans or plays are only as good as the personnel put together to complete them!
To blame a coach for the Tebow throw is just insane, to blame him for TE's running into each other is pretty crazy since they both have eyes to see each other as well as read the defense and to take away the credit of a great play from the LB that did not get to the QB but got his fingertips on the ball is a huge assumption on your part.

Last but not least, if the auburn coach took your advice and benched Cam Newton for free lancing then we would have won that game and coulda woulda shoulda....While running both offenses I had to make split second decisions and reads on the defense when I got to the line as well as after the snap. Do you not think you have to make split decisions in the pro set offense, read the defense, read the coverage, read the safeties and LB's once the ball is snapped.......

[b381l]

NowandForever, you play a lot of video football....right.

[GamecockMomSC]

Originally Posted by USCNowAndForever

Watching some past SEC games, it is interesting to me how often SEC teams fail to execute offensive plays correctly.

Examples:

2009 SEC Championship game

-Mark Ingram runs the ball to the right down on the goal line with Terrence Cody lead blocking. Cody barely makes the block and flies into the endzone and almost falls flat on his face.

-Tebow has Hernandez wide open behind the defense in the upper right corner of the endzone, and yet Tebow tries to throw more of a bullet pass and it is intercepted by Javier Arenas.

2012 USC-LSU game

-I have covered this one several times on here before, but USC's TEs fail to execute the Mesh play correctly.

2012 USC-UF game

-I have also covered this one several times on here before. USC's two right receivers run into each other while trying to run a Seam/In route combination.

2012 SEC Championship game

-UGA's running back fails to pass protect correctly, which leads to a Bama linebacker tipping Aaron Murray's pass.

These are just a few examples.

No one is perfect, but considering how well the SEC is known for football, not to mention the quality of coaching, how is this sort of stuff so commonplace in the SEC? Perhaps SEC teams tend to be so good at defense that there is no incentive for them to be better at offense?

Keep in mind that these sort of errors are usually not because of something the defense did, but rather they are execution errors where the offense beat themselves, especially with USC's TEs and WRs not running plays correctly.

Your underlying point is that USC played poor offense in some games we've recently lost. Well, duh. How about adding some cherry picks from the games that we have won if you truly want to discuss the quality of the Gamecock offense?

[gsmith4776]

First off, nobody is perfect and we all occasionally make mistakes. Esp. in high pressure situations with another team trying to counter everything u do.
Second, you argue that sec offenses are bad at execution. To me, this is a result of great sec defense and not so much incapable offense. Look no further than ooc games featuring sec teams. Bama rolls nd( who many said had great d). Lsu holds Clem to 25 points or so, we shut them down completely after 2 drives. Didn't the taters average like 40 plus a game in acc play? Hell, look at bowl games where other high powered teams get shut down by sec d and look how many points sec o scores. We rolled mich for 33 and they were a solid big 10 defense.
My point is, consistently when ooc teams face sec teams you see them make mistakes much more than usual, and offensively, sec teams who struggle to score points get more big plays and points, yards than normal. Yet this, according to u, has nothing to do with beast athletes playing d in an elite conference with some of the best coaches in all levels of football-FAIL

[robgusc76]

Im gonna give u the benefit of the doubt, and assume you've also watched games from other conferences and noticed that its like that in every league.

[Lalli25]

If offenses didn't make mistakes, then every game would be 70-63. Just like if the defense didn't make a single mistake, then the game would be 0-0. This whole thread is a waste.

SEC offenses make as many mistakes as other conferences, the differences is that there is less room for error when playing an SEC D. Sometimes a bad pass in other conferences is just incomplete or in some cases still go for a TD (Look at So Cal TD at end of the half against Oregon), but in the SEC those same plays turn into picks and big hits causing incompletions.

[USCNowAndForever]

Originally Posted by GamecockMomSC

Your underlying point is that USC played poor offense in some games we've recently lost, with the Bama/Notre Dame game thrown in to disguise this from being an anti-USC post. How about adding some cherry picks from the games that we have won if you truly want to discuss the quality of the Gamecock offense?

Did you even read the post you quoted?

[GamecockMomSC]

Originally Posted by USCNowAndForever

Did you even read the post you quoted?

Sorry. I read this thread very early this morning. I saw championship and Murray, and it went through my head as McCarron. I edited my original post, so thanks. Still, don't you think teams will play some poor O in games they lose? You have cherry picked a few games. USC has had two excellent seasons, but don't let that stop you from criticizing a few bad plays. I am in awe of your football knowledge.