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Old 12-12-2013, 11:02 AM   #81
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

Zbadger, get your facts checked. Next year will be Mikes 3rd year out of High School, in which like Clowney he can opt for the NFL. As you know Clowney last year was projected the #1 pick for this year. So you can't write new laws, Mike is also projected 1st round by Phil Steele the Espn NFL Draft expert.

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Old 12-12-2013, 11:13 AM   #82
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

Zbadger, The SEC top to bottom has better QB's than the Big 10. Therefore, SEC teams do more than run, They pass the ball. In doing so more plays are passing play, in which the results limit the number of running plays, limiting the total rushing yards. Yn our focus on stats are not complete, you should understand the SEC have Complete teams. Like the Coach of Wisconsin stated yesterday. "If we(Wisconsin) can't pass we will lose". On the other hand as we have seen all year, If Carolina run game is slow, the passing game picks up. In the passing game we have 4 very talented Wideouts, 3 very talented tightends, Three very talented RB's that catch out of the backfield.
That is why I say the game is going to be won in the passing game. Wisconsin at best have 2 DB's that can stay with us. No LBs that can cover our TE's. Which force Wisconsin to play zone defense. That will lead to Conner Shaw who is the best Duel QB Wisconsin will see this year.
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Old 12-12-2013, 11:13 AM   #83
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

A lot of draft sites are very high on Melvin Gordon.
Among draft eligible RBs he has been in the discussion for number 1.
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Old 12-12-2013, 11:18 AM   #84
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

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Originally Posted by U-Dub Gamecock View Post
Hell, gimme a shot at this:

QB: Carolina
RB: Push(If Mike Davis is 100% healthy, advantage to Wisconsin if he is not)
OL: Wisconsin
WR: Carolina
DL: Carolina
LB: Wisconsin
DB: Carolina
ST: Push

I have to agree with this. This seems right to me. Just listening to Brando's show and they were giving this game a lot of love. thought it was one of the better and more even games of the bowl season. Worthy of a BCS bowl. Good stuff.
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Old 12-12-2013, 12:16 PM   #85
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

I'm stoked as well - absolutely LOVE this matchup and think it's one of the most intriguing in all of Bowl Season. As a realist, it wouldn't shock me if the Badgers' 3-year streak of "losses by a touchdown or less" is broken here - I watched your Clemson and Missouri games and was very impressed. However, my guys have surprised me before.

ADDENDUM - My bad. This was supposed to be posted to the "I'm Stoked" thread... Regardless, the sentiments remain.

Last edited by BadgerBadger; 12-12-2013 at 12:23 PM. Reason: Posted in wrong thread!
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Old 12-12-2013, 12:52 PM   #86
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

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Originally Posted by BadgerBadger View Post
I'm stoked as well - absolutely LOVE this matchup and think it's one of the most intriguing in all of Bowl Season. As a realist, it wouldn't shock me if the Badgers' 3-year streak of "losses by a touchdown or less" is broken here - I watched your Clemson and Missouri games and was very impressed. However, my guys have surprised me before.

ADDENDUM - My bad. This was supposed to be posted to the "I'm Stoked" thread... Regardless, the sentiments remain.
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Old 12-12-2013, 01:18 PM   #87
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

Edit: I can't read -- My mistake
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Old 12-12-2013, 01:53 PM   #88
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

To get back on topic, I think it's more logical to compare units on one team to the competing unit on the other instead of just saying "QB - Advantage USC"

My opinions will be from the perspective of a Badgers, obviously, and I will try to provide information about Badger players along the way.

UW Passing Offense vs. USC Passing defense: Advantage USC - Many passing plays that UW runs are either slowly developing, play action, or deep routes (or combination of those). Thus, teams with strong pass rushing abilities pose a serious threat. Obviously you have to honor the play action, but UW's pass protection must be stellar. Stave is not mobile at all and does not throw well under pressure. He also does not check down particularly well. Luckily, #1 target Abbrederis is open a lot. Guy is a phenomenal route runner with good speed/agility. When healthy he is probably a top 10 WR nationaly. The Oline is good not great blocking the pass rush. Even though USC secondary is young I don't expect to consistently move down the field passing the ball. We will chunk you for 15-20 yards every so often. If things go the Badgers way we will hit a couple very deep balls (40+ yards) off the play action. However, the pass rush needs to be negated to hit these plays. TE Jacob Pederson is a common red zone target. Despite not being a great QB, Stave has actually been quite outstanding in the red zone. The rest of the WR crew are very average. For some reason he seems more comfortable going through progressions in this portion of the field. For all the doom and gloom UW posters have been sharing about our passing game (which is justified), we aren't a *bad* passing team. We just don't have to do it that often. You will probably laugh at some of the throws Stave misses, but he does have the ability to make any throw. His consistency will be crucial to UW's success.

USC Passing offense vs. UW passing defense: Advantage USC - Wisconsin is neither particularly strong rushing the passer or in coverage. Shelton (CB) is our best cover corner, but he is a true freshman. The rest of the secondary doesn't possess great ball skills. Southward (safety) has excellent speed, but it is more apparent crashing down to stop the run than in coverage. We don't have an all-star pass rusher, but we manage by creating confusion up front. Occasionally you may even see zero down lineman. Brendan Kelly is probably our best pure pass rusher.

UW rushing offense vs. USC rushing defense: Advantage UW - Not much to say here. We will run the ball on you. It won't be easy, and at times you will slow it down, but when the game is over and you look at the box score we will get our yards. Not trying to be disrespectful AT ALL, it's just what we do. This year's line isn't as stellar as it has been in years past, but it is still a strength of the team. White/Gordon (as stated previously) are excellent backs. White is smaller, but runs surprisingly well between the tackles for his size. He has outstanding burst/agility but not great home run speed. He is a threat to catch the ball out of the backfield, but we don't do it much (I'm not exactly sure why either). Gordon is the physical monster. Still relatively unpolished, but he is a threat to score every time he touches the ball. We haven't had a guy with that type of ability since Michael Bennett. The TE's and WR's are typically very strong at blocking downfield. Despite being a run heavy team, we hit a ton of big plays and the downfield blocking is a major part of that. Clement is a true freshman 3rd string RB. He really has only played in garbage time this season. He looks like a great player, but I don't expect him to have impact much this game. He could be our best between the tackles runner, so if he gets in it might be in a short yardage situation (but I doubt it).

USC rush offense vs. UW rush defense: Push - USC has an underrated oline and Davis is fun to watch. However, the undeniable strength of this UW defense is the front 7. We play a "3-4," but a lot of the time it won't look like one. Most of you have probably heard of Chris Borland, and he is as advertised. Very instinctive player who just seems to have a nose for the ball. We rotate DLineman quit a bit which helps keep fresh bodies on the field. There isn't a true "stud," but the line is very experienced and overall solid. Beau Allen is the "biggest" name on the line and is a very nice player. An interesting player to watch is Michael Caputo who plays sort of a hybrid safety/LB position. We have been pleasantly surprised with his development this season and he is a key cog on the defense. The confusion I mentioned in the passing defense discussion I feel makes a bigger impact on the running game. We play very aggressive stopping the run to get teams in 3rd and long. Not sure if this is still true, but for a while we lead the nation in 3 and out % as a defense.

Just a brief word about our special teams. Our kicker is not great. He's good from 35-40 yards in, but he does not have much experience with long FG's. He only became the starter about halfway through the season. He HAS made a 45+ yarder (47 I think), but I wouldn't be surprised if we went for it on 4th and short if we're around your 30 yardline. PR has been mostly Kenzel Doe, but he has muffed several kicks down the stretch. Jared Abbrederis fills in if Doe is benched. He actually returned punts full-time two years ago and lead the nation in yards per return. I'll just be praying that Doe doesn't muff one.

All in all, I think it should be a great game. I can honestly say that I still don't know how good we are exactly. We could have won either the ASU or Ohio St game, but we didn't. We lost to a very average Penn St team at home, and we thumped the other inferior competition we played. It's just been a hard year to gauge exactly how good this team is even though we've had 12 games to watch.

Good luck. Very excited for the matchup.
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Old 12-12-2013, 02:40 PM   #89
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

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Originally Posted by Travelin View Post
Thanks for the info! No way we will be taking you guys lightly. Our guys should be ready, but I'm expecting this one to be a nail-biter.



Who wants to bet they return a punt for a TD?
Badger return game is not a strength. Kenzell Doe who started the season at KR was demoted for his inability to field punts reliably. Abbrederis will return in the bowl game, and although he's dangerous for yards after the catch he's probably not a huge threat to take it to the house. Although if your cover team is bad enough, he does have good speed and with the added reps in bowl practice, who knows... Probably not your greatest area of worry, though.
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Old 12-12-2013, 02:44 PM   #90
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

To get back on topic, I think it's more logical to compare units on one team to the competing unit on the other instead of just saying "QB - Advantage USC"
UW Passing Offense vs. USC Passing defense: Advantage USC

I agree with this by and large. But, when opponents put ten guys in the box it creates opportunities in the passing game. If Stave can overcome whatever mental block that seems to bedevil him when Jared Abbrederis is wide open deep, the UW passing game could be a major factor.

But, if you're betting, assume that Abby will watch one or two balls sail over his head or land ten yards short on a play when there's nothing between him and the end zone other than the soft, Florida breeze. But the UW passing game can be dangerous with quick scores if Stave plays like he did at Iowa or at Columbus.

I'd also add that one of the things that frustrates about Stave is that he'll surprise you on 3rd and 8, making a great read, stepping up in the pocket and firing a dart to move the sticks. Then, on the next play, you'll swear that he's got to be in some bookies pocket. Just maddening.
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Old 12-12-2013, 03:10 PM   #91
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

IMO...we have not really played a team that seems to rely as much on the run as UW. Make no mistake about it, we have our work cut out for us and I think that most fans are concerned about our ability to stop the run. I have no doubt that you all will make some big plays in the running game...however, IMO, if you become one-dimensional I like our chances. I have confidence in the coverage skills of our CB's...especially in man coverage allowing us to bring one more into the box.

As for the RB stats, just remember...our best back up RB went out in the UCF game and missed many games which wore down on Mike Davis. He is back and healthy...he does not get much fanfare because he has been behing Lattimore and now Davis but he is a gamer. I hope to hear his name a lot in the bowl.
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Old 12-12-2013, 03:17 PM   #92
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

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IMO...we have not really played a team that seems to rely as much on the run as UW.
Florida
They passed the ball 13 times.
7 until their last two offensive drives in the 4th quarter (came with 2:16 and 0:12 left in the game)
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Old 12-12-2013, 03:45 PM   #93
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

Bucky, Georgia runs a 3/4 defense, we won 2 out of the last 3 games. This year we put 228 rushing and 246 passing. I promise you Wisconsin will try to run a zone defense. Wisconsin has not faced this year a Oline as big and physical as ours. Tighend Zandi 6'9 320, Robinson LT 6'8 331, LG AJ Cann 6'5 320, C Waldrop 6'3 320, RG Patrick 6'3 325,
RT Shell 6'6 325, TE Anderson 6'6 250,TE Adams 6'6 255, TE Owens 6'6 245. There is a reason we are 10 an 2, nobody this year has stop our offense. This year we average 450 yards/game the most in school history. After watching Penn State limit those running backs to 120 combined, and Ohio State limit them to 110 combined. advantage
Unless you think Penn State and Ohio State defense is better than Carolina.
Advantage Gamecocks Oline and DLine. Your previous Coach at Arkansas came in with a offensive line as big or bigger than Wisconsin. We put 52 to 7 because they had no passing game. Wisconsin passing game is poor at best. Advantage Gamecocks.
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Old 12-12-2013, 03:46 PM   #94
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

Yeah, the Gators are probably the most similar team we have played(compared to Wisc).. Being a physical running team... Obviously, Wisc has better RBs and a better QB... But we did shut down the run after halftime adjustments..
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Old 12-12-2013, 04:03 PM   #95
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

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USC currently has 29 NFL players with 3 offensive lineman. Wisconsin has 26 and 7 (should be 27 and 8, one player just retired mid season). And all the Badgers oline on Sunday played in the last 3 years for Wisconsin except for Joe Thomas (who is the best LT in the NFL). Wisconsin is known as an OL factory for good reason. This year's batch is no different, just younger. They will return 4 out of 5 next season.

In 2010, Kevin Zietler, Ricky Wagner, Gabe Garimi, John Moffit, Peter Konz, Travis Frederick, and Bill Nagy were part of the Badgers oline. Every single one of those guys made it to the NFL and played on Sunday. I miss that 2010 oline. They once ran 28 straight times against Michigan and scored on 4 straight possessions as a result. It was amazing.
Do you mostly run a zone on pass defense? If so, that will neutralize Connor Shaw's big plays. Your DBs have the heads facing up field and can flow to the ball carrier on a scramble run.

If you are in man to man, with your DBs backs facing the wrong way as they chase our WR on vertical seam routs, Connor can take off and take it for a TD as far out as 80 yards. Yes, he really is that fast. If memory serves me, Connor did it against Michigan (but the play was called back for illegal formation). I don't mean to underestimate the speed of your Gordon. I don't think you really appreciate (yet) the speed of Shaw either.
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Old 12-12-2013, 04:03 PM   #96
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

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Bucky, Georgia runs a 3/4 defense, we won 2 out of the last 3 games. This year we put 228 rushing and 246 passing. I promise you Wisconsin will try to run a zone defense. Wisconsin has not faced this year a Oline as big and physical as ours. Tighend Zandi 6'9 320, Robinson LT 6'8 331, LG AJ Cann 6'5 320, C Waldrop 6'3 320, RG Patrick 6'3 325,
RT Shell 6'6 325, TE Anderson 6'6 250,TE Adams 6'6 255, TE Owens 6'6 245. There is a reason we are 10 an 2, nobody this year has stop our offense. This year we average 450 yards/game the most in school history. After watching Penn State limit those running backs to 120 combined, and Ohio State limit them to 110 combined. advantage
Unless you think Penn State and Ohio State defense is better than Carolina.
Advantage Gamecocks Oline and DLine. Your previous Coach at Arkansas came in with a offensive line as big or bigger than Wisconsin. We put 52 to 7 because they had no passing game. Wisconsin passing game is poor at best. Advantage Gamecocks.
Careful drawing conclusions from "transitive property" type logic. I could do the same "OMG Shaw was 7-21 against a horrible Tennessee team. You think our defense isn't better than Tennessee's?" Just basing my comments on the eye test.

Saying our passing game is "poor at best" is simply inaccurate. On the season Stave completed >60% of his passes and had just under a 2:1 TD/INT ratio.

In terms of addressing the actual games...

Ohio State absolutely sold out to stop the run. If you want to do that, you can. Most don't sell out as hard as Ohio State did this season. It's not that we can't throw, it's just that we prefer not to. Stave had a nice game against Ohio St due to Abby being in single coverage for most of the night (10 rec, 207 yards). Melvin was also injured during that game.

Penn State we dug ourselves a hole early and just didn't run a ton (threw 53 times). Gordon also got hurt this game (had 13 carries for 91 yards up to that point). Frankly I wouldn't draw much from the Penn St game. As a whole we just dumped the bed, and I wouldn't chalk a whole lot up from that result. I guess we could play that poorly again, but I doubt it.
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Old 12-12-2013, 04:04 PM   #97
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

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Wisconsin has not faced this year a Oline as big and physical as ours. Tighend Zandi 6'9 320, Robinson LT 6'8 331, LG AJ Cann 6'5 320, C Waldrop 6'3 320, RG Patrick 6'3 325,
RT Shell 6'6 325, TE Anderson 6'6 250,TE Adams 6'6 255, TE Owens 6'6 245.
I guess if you exclude the dozen or so scrimmages when the Badger DL goes up against our own massive offensive line.....
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Old 12-12-2013, 04:05 PM   #98
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

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Do you mostly run a zone on pass defense? If so, that will neutralize Connor Shaw's big plays. Your DBs have the heads facing up field and can flow to the ball carrier on a scramble run.
We play mostly man coverage on the outside. Obviously Shaw is a threat to run, but I expect somebody with good speed like Ethan Armstrong or Caputo to play a spy in many scenarios. We are typically strong at containing running QB's.
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Old 12-12-2013, 04:20 PM   #99
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

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Careful drawing conclusions from "transitive property" type logic. I could do the same "OMG Shaw was 7-21 against a horrible Tennessee team. You think our defense isn't better than Tennessee's?" Just basing my comments on the eye test.

Saying our passing game is "poor at best" is simply inaccurate. On the season Stave completed >60% of his passes and had just under a 2:1 TD/INT ratio.

In terms of addressing the actual games...

Ohio State absolutely sold out to stop the run. If you want to do that, you can. Most don't sell out as hard as Ohio State did this season. It's not that we can't throw, it's just that we prefer not to. Stave had a nice game against Ohio St due to Abby being in single coverage for most of the night (10 rec, 207 yards). Melvin was also injured during that game.

Penn State we dug ourselves a hole early and just didn't run a ton (threw 53 times). Gordon also got hurt this game (had 13 carries for 91 yards up to that point). Frankly I wouldn't draw much from the Penn St game. As a whole we just dumped the bed, and I wouldn't chalk a whole lot up from that result. I guess we could play that poorly again, but I doubt it.
Sounds as though Gordon is susceptible to injury. Was he knocked out or limited in those games you mention because of physical play or is it something like he caught a cramp or pulled a hamstring or something?
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Old 12-12-2013, 04:23 PM   #100
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Default Re: Getting to Know Wisconsin

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Originally Posted by zoobadger View Post
I guess if you exclude the dozen or so scrimmages when the Badger DL goes up against our own massive offensive line.....
The intensity of games and scrimmages are completely different.
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