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Old 12-27-2013, 01:59 PM   #12881
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericvol2096 View Post
He's not going to kick anyone to the curb.

They have found a loop hole to be able to bring in 33 or so players this year.

We aren't going to have to get rid of any of our commits.
Didn't mean commits...
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Old 12-27-2013, 02:04 PM   #12882
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

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Originally Posted by SCohioBoy View Post
Didn't mean commits...
If we bring in 33 players that gives us 88 scholarship players right now.

Every program loses a few players every offseason for either grades, they don't like the playing time they are getting or especially with new coaches, don't see eye to eye with the way the program is run.

Still don't think he's "kicking anyone to the curb" as you so eloquently want to put it.
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Old 12-27-2013, 02:08 PM   #12883
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericvol2096 View Post
If we bring in 33 players that gives us 88 scholarship players right now.

Every program loses a few players every offseason for either grades, they don't like the playing time they are getting or especially with new coaches, don't see eye to eye with the way the program is run.

Still don't think he's "kicking anyone to the curb" as you so eloquently want to put it.
Again, whatever makes you feel better.
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Old 12-27-2013, 02:09 PM   #12884
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

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Originally Posted by SCohioBoy View Post
Again, whatever makes you feel better.
I don't have to feel better, there is absolutely nothing happening to feel bad about.

If SC doesn't lose 3 players to transfers this offseason, I would be shocked.

But if they do then I am sure Spurrier is kicking players off the team.
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Old 12-27-2013, 02:11 PM   #12885
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericvol2096 View Post
I don't have to feel better, there is absolutely nothing happening to feel bad about.

If SC doesn't lose 3 players to transfers this offseason, I would be shocked.

But if they do then I am sure Spurrier is kicking players off the team.
Take the orange glasses off, I know it is hard, but if you don't think what bi+ch is doing is shady as hell, then there really is no hope for you.
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Old 12-27-2013, 02:12 PM   #12886
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericvol2096 View Post
I don't have to feel better, there is absolutely nothing happening to feel bad about.

If SC doesn't lose 3 players to transfers this offseason, I would be shocked.

But if they do then I am sure Spurrier is kicking players off the team.
I agree, Butch is doing whats best for him and the Ut program. It's his first year, and I'm sure he will let most of those kids transfer to schools of their choice. Every team loses players to attrition whether it's right or wrong. If we are taking the full 22 for this 2014 class, then we are going to be losing some players this offseason, and it will be more than 3.
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Old 12-27-2013, 02:15 PM   #12887
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

Personally I think it is crap to offer 286 kids. More that 100+ offers than anyone else in the SEC offered. I guess when you are desperate...
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Old 12-27-2013, 02:21 PM   #12888
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

Anyway I think Scott ends up here, we have been after him for to long. One would think actually scouting the kid before he was really a note recruit has to mean something.
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Old 12-27-2013, 02:27 PM   #12889
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

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Originally Posted by SCohioBoy View Post
Personally I think it is crap to offer 286 kids. More that 100+ offers than anyone else in the SEC offered. I guess when you are desperate...
BINGO! Butch has inherited a program in shambles and he has to do whatever it takes to get it back on track. Players leave every year whether it is his own choice or the coaches encouragement for any number of reasons. Don't think for a second that it doesn't happen here as well (Nick St. Germain comes to mind). Usually it's due to the player not fulfilling his commitment to the team or classroom but sometimes a player just isn't good enough so the coach will help him find a smaller school willing to give him a scolly.
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Old 12-27-2013, 02:32 PM   #12890
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coondog View Post
BINGO! Butch has inherited a program in shambles and he has to do whatever it takes to get it back on track. Players leave every year whether it is his own choice or the coaches encouragement for any number of reasons. Don't think for a second that it doesn't happen here as well (Nick St. Germain comes to mind). Usually it's due to the player not fulfilling his commitment to the team or classroom but sometimes a player just isn't good enough so the coach will help him find a smaller school willing to give him a scolly.
Yes this isn't uncommon and isn't dirty for sure. I do know the few players that have left so far under Butch have been granted 100% releases to any school of their choice, even in the SEC if they could get that option.

Honestly Butch has done a really remarkable job in my opinion in every way except for not being able to get us to a bowl this year and that would have taken a perfect coaching year.

The biggest news is how much he has improved our players grades and our APR since he's been on campus. GPA's have gone through the roof and we avoided an APR bowl ban.

Also we have had 0 arrests in the year he's been coach. That is crazy...hope I didn't just jinx us.
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Old 12-27-2013, 02:37 PM   #12891
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

Quote:
Originally Posted by SCohioBoy View Post
Take the orange glasses off, I know it is hard, but if you don't think what bi+ch is doing is shady as hell, then there really is no hope for you.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...rive_web#gid=0

Link to stats of all NCAA programs and their retention percentages over the past 10 seasons. This doesn't include players who graduate or go to the NFL early.

Only players that are "booted" as you say or get arrested or fail out or leave on their own.

SC has lost 126 players the past 10 years this way 39%, just like TN.

SEC average is 38%. This is normal.

This link breaks it down by year.
https://drive.google.com/?tab=wo&aut...i1DMWd5TkN3OEE
Look at Kiffins one class at TN 80% left! WOW!
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Old 12-27-2013, 02:47 PM   #12892
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

They have found a loop hole to be able to bring in 33 or so players this year.


Vol, If you'll notice I haven't bashed UT about their recruiting at all. Here's the thing though, there is no loop hole that will allow you to sign 33 players in one class unless somehow a team could count back 8 early enrollee players to the previous class. Right now UT has 3 players already signed, just for grins let's say they can count those 3 back. That leaves 30 on the list & UT is still recruiting. Forget the 88 total ships, you still cannot bring in but 25 per class. Unless I'm wrong somebody's gonna get the shaft in this class unless you have a bunch of guys willing to greyshirt or Butch already knows they won't qualify. I've been following this stuff, wasting my time, for more years than any rational person should, but I'm always willing to learn.
What is this loop hole Butch is going to use to bring in 33+ players in a single class? Because right now he has 3 at max he can count back & if a players greyshirts he won't be in this class/year? I could very well be missing something & if I am, I want to be educated. Thx
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Old 12-27-2013, 02:49 PM   #12893
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

Quote:
Originally Posted by conwaycock2 View Post
They have found a loop hole to be able to bring in 33 or so players this year.


Vol, If you'll notice I haven't bashed UT about their recruiting at all. Here's the thing though, there is no loop hole that will allow you to sign 33 players in one class unless somehow a team could count back 8 early enrollee players to the previous class. Right now UT has 3 players already signed, just for grins let's say they can count those 3 back. That leaves 30 on the list & UT is still recruiting. Forget the 88 total ships, you still cannot bring in but 25 per class. Unless I'm wrong somebody's gonna get the shaft in this class unless you have a bunch of guys willing to greyshirt or Butch already knows they won't qualify. I've been following this stuff, wasting my time, for more years than any rational person should, but I'm always willing to learn.
What is this loop hole Butch is going to use to bring in 33+ players in a single class? Because right now he has 3 he can count back & if a players greyshirts he won't be in this class/year?
Found this, hope it helps:

The Rule

quote:
13.9.1 Letter of Intent – Limitation. Each SEC member institution is limited to signing 25 football prospective student-athletes to a National Letter of Intent, Conference financial aid agreement and/or institutional offer of athletics financial aid from December 1 through May 31st of each year. [Adopted 5/29/09; effective immediately; revised 6/3/11; effective August 1, 2011]


The possible Loop Hole

quote:
The dates are critical, because the SEC bylaw collides with a new NCAA rules interpretation that impacted this recruiting cycle. Academically eligible student-athletes who plan to enroll early (in January) are now allowed to sign aid agreements with universities as early as Aug. 1.

Tennessee had a flood of players sign aid agreements last month — perhaps a half-dozen players or more. Why is this significant? By the letter of the law, those players wouldn’t count against the SEC’s signing limit. They’re freebies, if you will.

Now, make no mistake: This loophole, if it’s real, doesn’t affect the scholarship limitations. But it would give Tennessee more flexibility than teams that haven’t yet discovered the loophole.

For example, let’s say five players sign aid agreements before Dec. 1, 2013, and enroll at UT in January.

UT can count back at least five scholarships against 2013 because that year’s class was under the 25-man limit. So that’s now 10 that wouldn’t count against the SEC signing limit

Jones has said he wants to welcome 14 mid-year enrollees in January. If the Vols were able take 10 of those players “off the books” for the purposes of the SEC signing rule, they could sign another 21 players to traditional Letters of Intent in February.

Grand total? 35.

Here is some more info:
http://www.ajc.com/weblogs/college-r...ing-loopholes/

What about those two loopholes?
The first has to do with the financial-aid agreements. Under the SEC’s “over-signing” bylaw (which went into effect around two years ago), schools are limited to signing 25 prospective student-athletes (PSAs) to a National Letter of Intent and financial aid from Dec. 1 to May 31 each year. This year, a new NCAA interpretation allowed kids who have been approved to enroll early to sign financial-aid agreements beginning on Aug. 1. According to Woodberry, the first loophole could be kids who signed before Dec. 1. “They’re freebies, if you will.”
The second possible loophole has to do with “blue-shirting.” Here’s Woodberry’s explanation: “Officially, a player arrives in the summer as a walk-on. Once football practice begins, he’s awarded a scholarship. The school is allowed to count the scholarship forward — against the 2015 class — but the player can play immediately. There’s a big catch: The student-athlete may not have been recruited, as defined by NCAA bylaws. That means no official visit to campus, no in-home visits from coaches, no signed National Letter of Intent or athletic aid.”
"Over-signing" is when a college signs more football recruits than scholarships available.
Again, all of this is just speculation as Jones has not publicly revealed his strategy. If true, however, it would not be surprising as most coaches are always trying to find a competitive edges in all phases of the game, especially recruiting.
We’ll see how all of this unfolds over the next six weeks.
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Old 12-27-2013, 02:52 PM   #12894
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericvol2096 View Post
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...rive_web#gid=0

Link to stats of all NCAA programs and their retention percentages over the past 10 seasons. This doesn't include players who graduate or go to the NFL early.

Only players that are "booted" as you say or get arrested or fail out or leave on their own.

SC has lost 126 players the past 10 years this way 39%, just like TN.

SEC average is 38%. This is normal.

This link breaks it down by year.
https://drive.google.com/?tab=wo&aut...i1DMWd5TkN3OEE
Look at Kiffins one class at TN 80% left! WOW!
Or are "asked" to leave.

Fact is ut is bring in more players than they should, so say what you will, ut will be asking players to leave.

And 286, again that is just wrong on so many levels.
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Old 12-27-2013, 02:59 PM   #12895
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

UT has 3 players already signed. To the best of my knowledge those are the only 3 that can be potentially counted back(assuming they signed no more than 22 last year). It's not that they're necessarily gonna have to run current players off, it's they cannot enroll more than 25 this class (28 counting the ones already signed)
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Old 12-27-2013, 03:01 PM   #12896
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

Quote:
Originally Posted by JDRAY^# View Post
Found this, hope it helps:

The Rule

quote:
13.9.1 Letter of Intent – Limitation. Each SEC member institution is limited to signing 25 football prospective student-athletes to a National Letter of Intent, Conference financial aid agreement and/or institutional offer of athletics financial aid from December 1 through May 31st of each year. [Adopted 5/29/09; effective immediately; revised 6/3/11; effective August 1, 2011]


The possible Loop Hole

quote:
The dates are critical, because the SEC bylaw collides with a new NCAA rules interpretation that impacted this recruiting cycle. Academically eligible student-athletes who plan to enroll early (in January) are now allowed to sign aid agreements with universities as early as Aug. 1.

Tennessee had a flood of players sign aid agreements last month — perhaps a half-dozen players or more. Why is this significant? By the letter of the law, those players wouldn’t count against the SEC’s signing limit. They’re freebies, if you will.

Now, make no mistake: This loophole, if it’s real, doesn’t affect the scholarship limitations. But it would give Tennessee more flexibility than teams that haven’t yet discovered the loophole.

For example, let’s say five players sign aid agreements before Dec. 1, 2013, and enroll at UT in January.

UT can count back at least five scholarships against 2013 because that year’s class was under the 25-man limit. So that’s now 10 that wouldn’t count against the SEC signing limit

Jones has said he wants to welcome 14 mid-year enrollees in January. If the Vols were able take 10 of those players “off the books” for the purposes of the SEC signing rule, they could sign another 21 players to traditional Letters of Intent in February.

Grand total? 35.

Here is some more info:
http://www.ajc.com/weblogs/college-r...ing-loopholes/

What about those two loopholes?
The first has to do with the financial-aid agreements. Under the SEC’s “over-signing” bylaw (which went into effect around two years ago), schools are limited to signing 25 prospective student-athletes (PSAs) to a National Letter of Intent and financial aid from Dec. 1 to May 31 each year. This year, a new NCAA interpretation allowed kids who have been approved to enroll early to sign financial-aid agreements beginning on Aug. 1. According to Woodberry, the first loophole could be kids who signed before Dec. 1. “They’re freebies, if you will.”
The second possible loophole has to do with “blue-shirting.” Here’s Woodberry’s explanation: “Officially, a player arrives in the summer as a walk-on. Once football practice begins, he’s awarded a scholarship. The school is allowed to count the scholarship forward — against the 2015 class — but the player can play immediately. There’s a big catch: The student-athlete may not have been recruited, as defined by NCAA bylaws. That means no official visit to campus, no in-home visits from coaches, no signed National Letter of Intent or athletic aid.”
"Over-signing" is when a college signs more football recruits than scholarships available.
Again, all of this is just speculation as Jones has not publicly revealed his strategy. If true, however, it would not be surprising as most coaches are always trying to find a competitive edges in all phases of the game, especially recruiting.
We’ll see how all of this unfolds over the next six weeks.
EricVol, is this the loophole?
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Old 12-27-2013, 03:04 PM   #12897
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

None of this belongs in Scott's thread, interesting or not.
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Old 12-27-2013, 03:06 PM   #12898
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

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Originally Posted by Acockolypse Now View Post
None of this belongs in Scott's thread, interesting or not.
Sure does, ut is going after this young man, we are his leader, we are just trying to figure out if he could even fit in ut's already bloated class.
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Old 12-27-2013, 03:16 PM   #12899
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Default Re: 2014 - Derrell Scott

This year, a new NCAA interpretation allowed kids who have been approved to enroll early to sign financial-aid agreements beginning on Aug. 1. According to Woodberry, the first loophole could be kids who signed before Dec. 1. “They’re freebies, if you will.” Perhaps this can explain some of the math. In the past those kids had to be counted in the current class or the previous class. Reading this quote would at least indicate that maybe those players don't have to be counted against any particular class but rather just the 85. That still doesn't explain the UT situation because even if the 3 are "freebies" there are still 30 players committed for a max of 25 spots. Pretty certain you can't count a guy back who signs in Feb to the previous class. The way this stuff is evolving I wouldn't make any concrete statements about what is permitted or not permitted other than the very basics. Still think somebody currently committed gets left at the bus station.
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Old 12-27-2013, 03:41 PM   #12900
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Default Re: 2014 - Kaylon "Poona" Ford - Louisville

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Originally Posted by ReadR00ster View Post
They accepted Stallworth's commitment since it looked like we weren't going to get Ford, so I wonder if we still take Ford. Interestingly, Scout.com has Stallworth listed as a "soft verbal" commitment though. I wonder if Ford is the reason why and if so, if that is based on solid info or they are just guessing that we end up with Ford and maybe not Stallworth.
Rooster there could be multiple things going on behind the scenes so your guess is as good as anybody else's. USC took the commitment from Stallworth way back in July when the numbers appeared to be much tighter then they are now. Since it was also before Ford committed to Louisville I have to assume he is someone they really want. Like coast said, the soft verbal just means a player is still taking or planning to take visits. I know BAW is, or at least was, listed as a soft verbal because he has a planned visit to Alabama.
There does appear to be something a little strange about the Stallworth commitment in that he was not offered by the big 2 in Alabama yet he seems to be less than totally committed to USC who is arguably his best offer based on where USC stands vs the competition.
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