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Old 02-10-2014, 09:57 AM   #181
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

You are a master at posting pics, yet not a I figured with your name you would be a master at debating. He sustained success with the players he was given. How many improved and went on to the NBA?
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Old 02-10-2014, 09:59 AM   #182
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

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Doesn't like the Brownell comparison.... Probably would hate to see Coach K's record.

Brownell inheirted a solid squad, not like he had to build from scratch.
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Old 02-10-2014, 09:59 AM   #183
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

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Originally Posted by SCohioBoy View Post
I have followed for a long time. Did not miss a game while I was in school. Martin has shown he ca recruit, yes. But I am not sold on him as a coach or a developer of talent. KState had a lot of talent while he was there, talent can cover up coaching, look at Ohio state the past few years. At this point the the season the freshman label does not apply. Fact is the kids still play way to tense. Look at the tam game, they played loose and ran away with it. They have not played the same way since. Too many blow outs. For those who say the players should get tougher skin or whatever to deal with Martin, I ask this, shouldn't a good coach know when to change his style to the players he has? He recruited these kids to play, so he can not blame not having the talent he wants.

Feel free to attack and slam me all you guys want, but ask yourselves this, has the team really improved since game one of the season ?
Says Frank can't develop talent, but Frank was recruiting about the same type of talent he is here and still won.

Says Frank can't coach, but Frank has been in the coaching profession for 28 years and made it as a head coach on the collegiate level, is well respected by coaches as a great coach, and is a proven winner.

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Old 02-10-2014, 10:01 AM   #184
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

HMM, Pullen, Sutton, Beasley, Walker--all were recruited by Huggins, Colon was the only player Martin recruited in that time period. His best year was with Pullen and Sutton- Huggins players.
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Old 02-10-2014, 10:04 AM   #185
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

Funny Darrin Horn's winning % at WKU was better than FM's Winning % at KState. We all agree Horn sucks, so what has Martin shown that makes people think he is better?
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Old 02-10-2014, 10:11 AM   #186
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

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Doesn't like the Brownell comparison.... Probably would hate to see Coach K's record.

Are you really trying to compare Coach K to Martin, LOL.
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Old 02-10-2014, 10:20 AM   #187
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

There is no debate.
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Old 02-10-2014, 10:23 AM   #188
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

Frank Martin has a TN football level rebuild job. He needs 4 years before you begin to judge him.

I have a feeling our streak of beating yall will end during baseball season.
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Old 02-10-2014, 10:25 AM   #189
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

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There is no debate.

Can you answer my question, have you honestly seen improvement this year?
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Old 02-10-2014, 10:26 AM   #190
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

I must admit that I am worried by the lack of improvement/development we have seen as a whole this season. Not saying Frank is a bad coach, or can't develop talent. I just hoped to see some improvement by this point in the season.
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Old 02-10-2014, 10:26 AM   #191
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

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Frank Martin has a TN football level rebuild job. He needs 4 years before you begin to judge him.

I have a feeling our streak of beating yall will end during baseball season.
LOL, your program was not in as bad of shape as our hoops program.
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Old 02-10-2014, 10:55 AM   #192
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

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Joke of a team or a underachiving team? Roman Galloway was great at LaSalle. We all can agree Horn ran things into the ground.

But I think the nail was hit on the head, FM didn't inherit a tournament team, like he did at KState. He has no track record of program building, which is what we needed. Martin was able to take what Huggins put in at KState, Beasley, Sutton, Pullen, Walker, and run with it. He was going to get run out of town and we landed him.

Look I hope he can turn this around, but it is not looking like he can, IMO he was the wrong hire. I am all for giving him another year, maybe two, but he really needs to show improvement, as a coach, and on the court.
How many of horns players were even on the team when he arrived? 4? He didn't get a chance to coach Ramon or Gill or Harris. He got left with Damian Leonard who was a complete bust and a 5 foot tall point guard who could barely dribble. I'm like you, I hope it all works out, I just don't think it's fair to judge him so bad right now.
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Old 02-10-2014, 11:03 AM   #193
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

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How many of horns players were even on the team when he arrived? 4? He didn't get a chance to coach Ramon or Gill or Harris. He got left with Damian Leonard who was a complete bust and a 5 foot tall point guard who could barely dribble. I'm like you, I hope it all works out, I just don't think it's fair to judge him so bad right now.
I think we can all agree the talent was upgraded this year, but the team has not improved. Yes there are a bunch of Freshman, but at this point in the season they have 20 plus games under their belt, not really freshman at this point.

Last year we ran with 8 players, 3-4(Bruce) were still here this year. I think Ty is an upgrade over Eric Smith, Thronwell is a upgrade over Richardson and Harris/Ringer are upgrades over Jackson/Slawson, talent wise. There should be signs on marked improvement.
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Old 02-10-2014, 11:18 AM   #194
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

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Funny Darrin Horn's winning % at WKU was better than FM's Winning % at KState. We all agree Horn sucks, so what has Martin shown that makes people think he is better?
This is a serious question?

Horn coached in the Sunbelt and made the NCAA Tournament 1 time. The year after, we overpaid him because of a ridiculous shot Courtney Lee made to get them to the Sweet 16.

Frank made the NCAA Tournament 4 times at K-State in the Big 12.

Also, if people are using the argument that Martin was winning with Huggins players, then what do you think Bruce Weber has done so far with Martin's players? K-State went 27-8 last season

Quote:
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I think we can all agree the talent was upgraded this year, but the team has not improved. Yes there are a bunch of Freshman, but at this point in the season they have 20 plus games under their belt, not really freshman at this point.

Last year we ran with 8 players, 3-4(Bruce) were still here this year. I think Ty is an upgrade over Eric Smith, Thronwell is a upgrade over Richardson and Harris/Ringer are upgrades over Jackson/Slawson, talent wise. There should be signs on marked improvement.
They are still freshmen until the season is over. This is college basketball, unless you have the most elite freshmen, teams led by freshmen generally will struggle. We have some good and promising freshmen but they are learning on the job with no upperclassmen to really help them out besides Brenton Williams.

The defense has improved and this is only our third double-digit loss in SEC play. I don't get why people are expecting this team to beat experienced teams like Ole Miss, Florida and Tennessee on the road. You're really questioning Martin because he can't get a team with 7 freshmen and 5 sophomores to beat proven programs?

This is not a 2 year project, this is a long-term thing. Look how long it took Dawn Staley and Steve Spurrier to turn around the women's basketball and football programs.
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Old 02-10-2014, 11:23 AM   #195
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

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This is a serious question?

Horn coached in the Sunbelt and made the NCAA Tournament 1 time. The year after, we overpaid him because of a ridiculous shot Courtney Lee made to get them to the Sweet 16.

Frank made the NCAA Tournament 4 times at K-State in the Big 12.

Also, if people are using the argument that Martin was winning with Huggins players, then what do you think Bruce Weber has done so far with Martin's players? K-State went 27-8 last season
I am not saying Horn was anything of a good coach, but he did do well at WKU, they improved from year one on.

Hmm, So Bruce Weber did better with Martin's players? 22-11 in his last year at KSTATE. My point about Martin at KSTATE is Huggins but them on the map, Martin ran with it and Weber has kept it going.

you can call me a troll, but the fact is I have supported this team from the time I started school, 2001 and will do so till I die. I want to see them do great things, I see no reason why they can not. I have stated I am not sure Marshall was the right man, though he looks more and more like the real deal, but I also didn't think Martin was the answer at all.
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Old 02-10-2014, 11:27 AM   #196
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

Duane Notice isn't getting it done. Frank will get it together next year. Chat needs more playing time, he was nailing those 8-12' shots and will get better. I hate that we lose Brent but a big rotation of Ty, Sid, Carrera, Henry, and Chat could be pretty good and a smaller one with Henry sliding down and Steele coming in...IDk...still need more scorers.
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Old 02-10-2014, 11:27 AM   #197
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

I do miss Odom.
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Old 02-10-2014, 11:41 AM   #198
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

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I am not saying Horn was anything of a good coach, but he did do well at WKU, they improved from year one on.

Hmm, So Bruce Weber did better with Martin's players? 22-11 in his last year at KSTATE. My point about Martin at KSTATE is Huggins but them on the map, Martin ran with it and Weber has kept it going.
You're playing two sides of the fence. You're saying that Martin won with Huggins players, so he isn't that good. But then you're ignoring that Weber was winning with Martin's players the year before. Which one is it?

Quote:
you can call me a troll, but the fact is I have supported this team from the time I started school, 2001 and will do so till I die. I want to see them do great things, I see no reason why they can not. I have stated I am not sure Marshall was the right man, though he looks more and more like the real deal, but I also didn't think Martin was the answer at all.
You're throwing the towel in on Frank Martin 3/4's of the way into his 1st season with his own players. Do you not understand how ridiculously dumb that is?

Did you want Dawn Staley fired after her 2nd season too? How about Spurrier? If this was Year 4 or 5 of Martin with his own players, your point would be completely valid.

This team lacks three big things right now:

1. Experience
2. Talent
3. Offensive Punch

These are things that come with building a program. If we land a big fish like P.J. Dozier or Seventh Woods and continue to bring in solid complimentary pieces, this thing will turn around completely.

But if you're expecting this team to beat experienced SEC programs right now, you have unrealistic expectations and criticisms.
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Old 02-10-2014, 11:47 AM   #199
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

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Brownell inheirted a solid squad, not like he had to build from scratch.
Brownell inherited Purnell's players in his first season. It was a team that had been to the NCAA Tournament the 3 seasons before that.

None of the players from the last Clemson NCAA Tournament team are on the team right now. Their team is led by three juniors in Rod Hall, K.J. McDaniels and DeMarcus Harrison. I watched the Syracuse game last night and they kept it competitive for most of the game before inevitably losing by 13.

Brownell built the program from scratch, got guys who could buy in and now they have a team who could get back to the tournament. Why not give Frank the same amount of time to do that here?

USC gave Horn 4 years and when it was clear there was no light at the end of the tunnel, they canned him. The only time the team showed promise was with the team Dave Odom created.
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Old 02-10-2014, 11:50 AM   #200
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Default Re: **USC vs. Tennessee GAME Thread**

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You're playing two sides of the fence. You're saying that Martin won with Huggins players, so he isn't that good. But then you're ignoring that Weber was winning with Martin's players the year before. Which one is it?



You're throwing the towel in on Frank Martin 3/4's of the way into his 1st season with his own players. Do you not understand how ridiculously dumb that is?

Did you want Dawn Staley fired after her 2nd season too? How about Spurrier? If this was Year 4 or 5 of Martin with his own players, your point would be completely valid.

This team lacks three big things right now:

1. Experience
2. Talent
3. Offensive Punch

These are things that come with building a program. If we land a big fish like P.J. Dozier or Seventh Woods and continue to bring in solid complimentary pieces, this thing will turn around completely.

But if you're expecting this team to beat experienced SEC programs right now, you have unrealistic expectations and criticisms.
No I said Weber is till running what was there, and infact had a better record than Martin with Martin's players.

As for the 3 things we lack, at this point, exeperince is there. 20 plus games into the season, you know how to play with your teammates and should know what your team is trying to do.

The talent is there, or should be there. It has been upgraded from the last year.

And my expections are improvement, getting blown out game after game is not improving.
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