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Old 05-11-2014, 04:44 PM   #21
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

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Originally Posted by Gamecocks1137 View Post
What does that have to do with anything? If your talking mechanics, Connor Shaw did not and does not throw the ball or release it like Tim Tebow.
He's talking about college success.

College success does not always equal professional success.
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Old 05-11-2014, 04:53 PM   #22
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

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Originally Posted by Gamecocks1137 View Post
I have a question about that, and I have had it for a while. IF he or anyone else lacks arm strength throwing a football, why can't he just improve his strength in his arms, lifting weights, and gaining muscle.
Others have covered this well (I liked the 90 hour fastball analogy), but to give a perfect example, Tim Tebow probably had the strongest arms -- in terms of weight room strength -- of any quarterback in NFL history. And yet, one of the big knocks on him as a passer was "lack of arm strength."

Throwing a football with elite velocity is a biomechanical motion ability that some are simply born with. Any improvements in a passer's "arm strength" are more likely to be technique improvements than weight lifting related improvements.

On the other end of the spectrum from Tebow, Jay Cutler intentionally trimmed about 20 pounds due to his diabetes a few years ago. He probably lost some weight room strength, but his passing "arm strength" was unaffected. He will always have a cannon, no matter how skinny he gets.
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Old 05-11-2014, 04:56 PM   #23
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

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Really, it boils down to mechanics, decision making and arm strength. being successful in college does not mean you will be a successful NFL quarterback. The game is much faster, so you have to get the ball out quick. It's very difficult. You have to have a quick release because DE's, LB's and DT's are all top of the top and are swiping at it.
Agree...and there were plenty of other guys available that displayed better NFL potential that Connor factoring in your comments I highlighted (that's why they got drafted).
Not so sure Aaron Murray is not victim of the same thing....

I've always viewed Connor as an excellent athlete playing QB....not so much the other way around. But he still has a chance.....he's a smart guy who throws accurately....hopefully that gets him somewhere....there are a few guys like him in the league, but they do have the big arms.
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Old 05-11-2014, 07:04 PM   #24
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

Or if he had gotten us to the SECCG which he never did. There would have been more national light on him. As great as he was, he never won the road game we needed to go to Atlanta. Bash me if you want but it's true. Only one QB has gotten us there but I will say if HBC had put Shaw in the 2011 Auburn instead of 2010 Auburn game, Shaw would have led us to a win in 2011 against Auburn. HBC picked the wrong Auburn game to not put Shaw in.
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Old 05-11-2014, 07:22 PM   #25
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

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I'm by no means a tebow apologist but did win a play off game

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I847 using Tapatalk 2

Oh here we go again.


Yes, HIS TEAM won a playoff game. He was 10-21 that day and completed a pass at the end. The Broncos Defense is why they made the playoffs that year and a terrible AFC west is why they made it with an 8-8 record, losing their last 3 in a row.

I don't hate him or love him, but he is not a good NFL qb. 32 NFL teams appear to agree.
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Old 05-11-2014, 07:25 PM   #26
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

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I can't understand why GM's can turn their heads on a QB who is undefeated as a starter in Bowl games. Has defeated other SEC and ACC QB's consecutively that were drafted, is a hard worker and no off the field issues. I understand they think his durability and height is a question mark, but c'mon so is Mettenberger. The only difference is that he is 6'4.
no that's not the only difference.....winning in college doesn't necessarily translate to winning in the NFL. while Connor was a great QB for us, he doesn't have the attributes necessary to be an NFL QB.
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Old 05-11-2014, 07:26 PM   #27
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

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Agree...and there were plenty of other guys available that displayed better NFL potential that Connor factoring in your comments I highlighted (that's why they got drafted).
Not so sure Aaron Murray is not victim of the same thing....

I've always viewed Connor as an excellent athlete playing QB....not so much the other way around. But he still has a chance.....he's a smart guy who throws accurately....hopefully that gets him somewhere....there are a few guys like him in the league, but they do have the big arms.

They were talking to Dave Caldwell, the Jags GM the other day..before the draft He said he put most of the emphasis on decision making. In other words, pulling the trigger and making the throw. I think back to the number of times I heard SOS saying that he needed to throw the ball more and quicker.

That being said, I think that Connor could be successful being an NFL QB if he was given the time and resources to develop. The problem is that they don't groom qb's anymore. They want a ready made one because there are so many new guys coming out every year.
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Old 05-11-2014, 07:27 PM   #28
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

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What does that have to do with anything? If your talking mechanics, Connor Shaw did not and does not throw the ball or release it like Tim Tebow.
it means just because you win at college doesn't mean you can do it in the NFL.....that's what it means.....I'm not talking about mechanics, I'm talking about reading defenses, seeing the field, going through progressions, and arm strength.....and doing all that in an
instant.
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Old 05-11-2014, 10:05 PM   #29
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

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no that's not the only difference.....winning in college doesn't necessarily translate to winning in the NFL. while Connor was a great QB for us, he doesn't have the attributes necessary to be an NFL QB.
If your talking about Connor's height in terms of attributes, of course he is possibly as tall as he's going to get, you're right. As for his mechanics and arm strength, the S&C and QB coaches for the Browns can help him out.
Connor has the maturity and the strive in my opinion so I do believe he has what it takes personally to be an NFL QB.
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Old 05-11-2014, 10:42 PM   #30
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

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The problem is that they don't groom qb's anymore. They want a ready made one because there are so many new guys coming out every year.
Yep...they want franchise guys right out of the draft....guys who can get them to the playoffs ASAP. It may not be realistic, but they are the ones being pressured to win now...and have to find who is best equipped to do that.
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Old 05-11-2014, 11:15 PM   #31
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

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Originally Posted by JaxcockFL View Post
Oh here we go again.


Yes, HIS TEAM won a playoff game. He was 10-21 that day and completed a pass at the end. The Broncos Defense is why they made the playoffs that year and a terrible AFC west is why they made it with an 8-8 record, losing their last 3 in a row.

I don't hate him or love him, but he is not a good NFL qb. 32 NFL teams appear to agree.
The most surprising fact about Tim Tebow is that if you look at the last 17 Quarterbacks to win the Heisman Trophy, he is the only one that has won a playoff game (yes I know Manziel and Winston have not played in the NFL yet).
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Old 05-11-2014, 11:33 PM   #32
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

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Originally Posted by FanofCarolina1 View Post
If your talking about Connor's height in terms of attributes, of course he is possibly as tall as he's going to get, you're right. As for his mechanics and arm strength, the S&C and QB coaches for the Browns can help him out.
Connor has the maturity and the strive in my opinion so I do believe he has what it takes personally to be an NFL QB.
I wasn't taking about his height....he's the same height as Drew Brees or Russell Wilson. See post #28.
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Old 05-12-2014, 03:47 AM   #33
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

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no that's not the only difference.....winning in college doesn't necessarily translate to winning in the NFL. while Connor was a great QB for us, he doesn't have the attributes necessary to be an NFL QB.
While Connor lacks some of the traits NFL teams tend to look for, your statement is way too dismissive of his chances. With your statement, you are essentially saying he can't make it. I'm sorry, but that's bullsh**. If at any point in his career he makes a 53 man roster, your statement will be proven to be bullsh**, and maybe you'll learn a valuable lesson about heart, guts, tenacity, and the folly of underestimating Connor Shaw.
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Old 05-12-2014, 08:23 AM   #34
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

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If at any point in his career he makes a 53 man roster, your statement will be proven to be bullsh**, and maybe you'll learn a valuable lesson about heart, guts, tenacity, and the folly of underestimating Connor Shaw.
Agree. I have my reservations about Connor's future as a pro, but there were plenty on this very forum that doubted he'd ever become an effective SEC QB, which he proved them wrong.
Dude plays smart and wins lots of games...maybe there's a place for that at the next level?
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Old 05-12-2014, 09:14 AM   #35
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

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no that's not the only difference.....winning in college doesn't necessarily translate to winning in the NFL. while Connor was a great QB for us, he doesn't have the attributes necessary to be an NFL QB.
By all standards then, neither does Russell Wilson yet somehow he has a Superbowl ring.
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Old 05-12-2014, 09:20 AM   #36
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

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Really, it boils down to mechanics, decision making and arm strength. being successful in college does not mean you will be a successful NFL quarterback. See Vince Young, Tim Tebow, Tim Couch, JaMarcus Russell, Ryan Leaf, Blaine Gabbert and a ton of other guys. The game is much faster, so you have to get the ball out quick. It's very difficult. You have to have a quick release because DE's, LB's and DT's are all top of the top and are swiping at it.
Exactly! The college game does not always translate to the pro level. Connor does not have great arm strength or a quick release or ideal size.

I don't understand why some people on here are saying he won't get a shot. He's getting a shot with the Browns. He'll have his chance to prove whether or not he can play in the NFL.
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Old 05-12-2014, 09:23 AM   #37
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

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By all standards then, neither does Russell Wilson yet somehow he has a Superbowl ring.
Yes he does. Minus his height (which is the same as Drew Brees) he has a rocket arm, quick release, very accurate, great mechanics, large hands and is quick in the pocket. He also makes very good decisions.

He's very similar to Drew Brees.
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Old 05-12-2014, 09:24 AM   #38
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

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By all standards then, neither does Russell Wilson yet somehow he has a Superbowl ring.
Wilson has some attributes that are just outstanding. Great arm strength, accuracy, quick release, and unbelievablely smart and excellent preparation and understanding of the game. Very quick feet and escapability and pocket awareness
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Old 05-12-2014, 10:54 AM   #39
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

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Originally Posted by Kazak View Post
While Connor lacks some of the traits NFL teams tend to look for, your statement is way too dismissive of his chances. If at any point in his career he makes a 53 man roster, maybe you'll learn a valuable lesson about heart, guts, tenacity, and the folly of underestimating Connor Shaw.
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Agree. I have my reservations about Connor's future as a pro, but there were plenty on this very forum that doubted he'd ever become an effective SEC QB, which he proved them wrong.
Dude plays smart and wins lots of games...maybe there's a place for that at the next level?
I certainly learned that combining these qualities with a HOF ballcoach produces results like no others.
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Old 05-12-2014, 11:10 AM   #40
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Default Re: If Connor Shaw's passing stats had been higher?

There are a few things that held Connor back, IMO:

1) His height / poor field vision
2) His ball velocity
3) His injuries the past 2 seasons
4) His inability to win the big one on the road (I suppose @Missouri counts but he lost @Arkansas, @LSU, @UF, @UGA, and @UT) and he really didn't play too well in those games.
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