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Old 06-13-2014, 03:17 PM   #21
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Default Re: D-line Progress

I strongly suspect we will not have a 10 or 13 sack lineman this year unless someone just has a couple of tear-it-up games and isn't game-planned against. I do expect more sacks than this year spread among six or seven guys. The reasons include the lack of a pass-rush star and the absence of Clowney causing teams to attempt much more dropback passing than they dared to do last year. The gang of no-names may well make them pay. This year our sack leader was not Clowney but a quick (not fast DT) who had one of the highest sack totals in the conference. Dropback plays are also much more vulnerable to corner and OLB stunts than the 2 step drops we saw this year because of Clowney.
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Old 06-13-2014, 03:18 PM   #22
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Default Re: D-line Progress

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Originally Posted by PageUSC View Post
It really sucks that Sawyer had to go to JUCO and likely that Thomas probably won't get in. Those 2 were physically ready to contribute.

Then add in that Ritchie didn't qualify and Wideman likely won't either and McClain is hurt. Just a shame. But Thomas and Sawyer really hurt.

I think most of our pass rush will come from English and Johnson.
I agree with you that Sawyer and Thomas hurt the depth. Besides Washington and English ,those were the only two we signed since 2012 that I was excited about. I don't know about Johnson, he still seem like a Chub. I can see he puts in a lot of effort and I hope he proves me wrong.
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Old 06-13-2014, 03:30 PM   #23
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Default Re: D-line Progress

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Originally Posted by BigMike View Post
I agree with you that Sawyer and Thomas hurt the depth. Besides Washington and English ,those were the only two we signed since 2012 that I was excited about. I don't know about Johnson, he still seem like a Chub. I can see he puts in a lot of effort and I hope he proves me wrong.
I'm confused with David Johnson, he came in as a pretty highly rated OLB at 6'1 245 with impressive stats throughout his high school career but we have him listed now at 6'1 280, is this right? That would mean he gained 35lbs his RS FR year.
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Old 06-13-2014, 03:39 PM   #24
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Default Re: D-line Progress

Even in the picture, it looks like English is being tied up by the offensive blocker. It is no wonder that the coaches are saying he needs to work on technique.

A good DE will keep his body away from the OL big bodies. It does two things. One, it makes it harder to block him. Two, if you do try to grab, it is possible even a blind SEC official will call holding.
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Old 06-13-2014, 03:42 PM   #25
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Default Re: D-line Progress

We had 25 total sacks last year in 13 games; not exactly stellar.

I'd rather see us blitz more and be a little more multiple. I felt like we relied too much on sending 4 and dropping 7 in the past. Not necessarily in '11 or '12, but last year. When teams max protected and dared us to drop 7.
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Old 06-13-2014, 03:52 PM   #26
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Default Re: D-line Progress

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Originally Posted by sunbeam View Post
Was looking for Gerald Turner and see he was moved to fullback. Only 250 pounds or so according to gamecock central's roster. Looks like another tweener guy that isn't going to grow.

Figured he and Johnson would turn into dt's.
He's 19. He can be as big and as strong as he wants to if he is dedicated.
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Old 06-13-2014, 03:55 PM   #27
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Default Re: D-line Progress

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Originally Posted by Helicopter Cock View Post
We had 25 total sacks last year in 13 games; not exactly stellar.

I'd rather see us blitz more and be a little more multiple. I felt like we relied too much on sending 4 and dropping 7 in the past. Not necessarily in '11 or '12, but last year. When teams max protected and dared us to drop 7.
Yea our pass rush last year was average at best. Quarles was really the only guy that had more than 4 sacks I think.

Gotta do better than that this year.
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Old 06-13-2014, 03:58 PM   #28
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Default Re: D-line Progress

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Originally Posted by yazoo View Post
Even in the picture, it looks like English is being tied up by the offensive blocker. It is no wonder that the coaches are saying he needs to work on technique.

A good DE will keep his body away from the OL big bodies. It does two things. One, it makes it harder to block him. Two, if you do try to grab, it is possible even a blind SEC official will call holding.
you got that from a practice drill still picture that you have no idea what they are supposed to do, none, you do not even know if English is rushing or playing the blocker?
Take a look at him in this video during the interview and see if it helps ease your worries...
http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=...A96E36CF53C2A8
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Old 06-13-2014, 04:02 PM   #29
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Default Re: D-line Progress

There is more than one way to skin a cat. Wammy won't do things the same as last year judging by his hints.
I think we are reading our DEs wrong. Darius English is just the guy we need at a DE. Hes got long arms like Devon Taylor and at just under 250lbs now. We should have learned from Clowney that speed is the best weapon of a DE not size. Devon Taylor swatted down quite a few passes with his long arms. We will see English do that now. .There are some even bigger guys behind English who can move as well. I see no reason to fear
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Old 06-13-2014, 04:31 PM   #30
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Default Re: D-line Progress

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Originally Posted by ZenUSC View Post
There is more than one way to skin a cat. Wammy won't do things the same as last year judging by his hints.
I think we are reading our DEs wrong. Darius English is just the guy we need at a DE. Hes got long arms like Devon Taylor and at just under 250lbs now. We should have learned from Clowney that speed is the best weapon of a DE not size. Devon Taylor swatted down quite a few passes with his long arms. We will see English do that now. .There are some even bigger guys behind English who can move as well. I see no reason to fear
Like I said before D. English is the most athletic Defensive lineman we have on our talented roster. He has all the raw tools like quick first step, natural strength, long arms, elite speed, and intelligence. If he puts in the effort the next two years he should have earn a nice paycheck for himself.
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Old 06-13-2014, 05:15 PM   #31
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Default Re: D-line Progress

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Originally Posted by Helicopter Cock View Post
We had 25 total sacks last year in 13 games; not exactly stellar.

I'd rather see us blitz more and be a little more multiple. I felt like we relied too much on sending 4 and dropping 7 in the past. Not necessarily in '11 or '12, but last year. When teams max protected and dared us to drop 7.
Please bear in mind that every team schemed away from our pass rush last year. The coaches were not phased a bit by few sacks against UNC and ECU. Most other teams, including UCF schemed to use 2-step, WR screens, passes to backs, and heavy running games (mostly to our left) to defeat our pass rush. Even then, we got lots of hurries. Mighty Clemson gave up 5 (including Sutton's best play of the year), the highest total while only getting 225 yards passing (their second-lowest). Pass rush consists of much more than getting sacks - such as changing a team's whole gameplan. The silly criticism of Clowney's numbers didn't take those other factors into account. Our coaches (and the Texans) did.
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Old 06-13-2014, 05:24 PM   #32
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Default Re: D-line Progress

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Originally Posted by ZenUSC View Post
Darius English is just the guy we need at a DE. Hes got long arms like Devon Taylor and at just under 250lbs now. We should have learned from Clowney that speed is the best weapon of a DE not size..
Hopefully he puts the strength and technique to good use this year, last year he was a lot lighter than this year, and the OT's simply guided him upfield away from the QB most of the time I saw him playing.
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Old 06-13-2014, 05:39 PM   #33
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Default Re: D-line Progress

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Hopefully he puts the strength and technique to good use this year, last year he was a lot lighter than this year, and the OT's simply guided him upfield away from the QB most of the time I saw him playing.
He still had .5 sacks, 2.5 TFL, 1 QBH and a 1 Forced Fumble to go with 19 tackles. He is ready to step it up. I believe he will be very good, he has elite speed and quickness to go with strength and arm length, Clowney weighed 5-7 more pounds then English does during his freshmen season and 12-15 when he left so I do not see weight being an issue this year. Correct me if I'm wrong but was Clowney ever in the top 5 pound for pound guys on the team?
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Old 06-13-2014, 06:43 PM   #34
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Default Re: D-line Progress

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Originally Posted by qcgamecock View Post
you got that from a practice drill still picture that you have no idea what they are supposed to do, none, you do not even know if English is rushing or playing the blocker?
Take a look at him in this video during the interview and see if it helps ease your worries...
http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=...A96E36CF53C2A8
True. But the link you sent me was noise also. I would like to see some evidence before I become more optimistic about the pass rush.

I do agree, however, that maybe we were too one dimensional last year in that we blitzed infrequently. Still, even last year we played a decent amount of zone blitz. Don't you recall all the whining about Clowney dropping into coverage? What a sin that was! Now, Houston is going to play him at LB. (Maybe our coaches were not stupid after all.)

Hopefully, whatever new D scheme we are playing up front this year confuses opponents and not ourselves. And of course, generates more sacks, losses, and turnovers.
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Old 06-13-2014, 08:55 PM   #35
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Default Re: D-line Progress

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True. But the link you sent me was noise also. I would like to see some evidence before I become more optimistic about the pass rush.

I do agree, however, that maybe we were too one dimensional last year in that we blitzed infrequently. Still, even last year we played a decent amount of zone blitz. Don't you recall all the whining about Clowney dropping into coverage? What a sin that was! Now, Houston is going to play him at LB. (Maybe our coaches were not stupid after all.)

Hopefully, whatever new D scheme we are playing up front this year confuses opponents and not ourselves. And of course, generates more sacks, losses, and turnovers.
I understand the trepidation but with the way we have recruited the last 4 years and the athletes we have at LB, DT and DE I believe Whammy will have them ready and if not hopefully the offense can out score them this year. We will blitz freely from different positions in a 3-4, 4-3, or 4-2-5 as we have experienced players ready to battle for playing time IMO. Summer time is when titles are won!
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Old 06-13-2014, 09:11 PM   #36
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Default Re: D-line Progress

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I understand the trepidation but with the way we have recruited the last 4 years and the athletes we have at LB, DT and DE I believe Whammy will have them ready and if not hopefully the offense can out score them this year. We will blitz freely from different positions in a 3-4, 4-3, or 4-2-5 as we have experienced players ready to battle for playing time IMO. Summer time is when titles are won!
bleh. It is talking season.
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Old 06-13-2014, 10:20 PM   #37
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Default Re: D-line Progress

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Originally Posted by yazoo View Post
Even in the picture, it looks like English is being tied up by the offensive blocker. It is no wonder that the coaches are saying he needs to work on technique.

A good DE will keep his body away from the OL big bodies. It does two things. One, it makes it harder to block him. Two, if you do try to grab, it is possible even a blind SEC official will call holding.
You're right, good d lineman use their arms as leverage and for separation. I still stand by my thought if d lineman learn to use their hands like sumo wrestlers that it would add a fantastic element to their game.
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Old 06-14-2014, 09:27 AM   #38
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Default Re: D-line Progress

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Scares the shit out of me. If you don't have this in the SEC, you are meat.
Don't worry man, you're not the only one who is petrified by that statement. Really, you're not the only one who's petrified of our defense regardless.

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Old 06-14-2014, 10:06 AM   #39
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Default Re: D-line Progress

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"We don't have a pass rusher" being a direct quote from our coach should be unsettling to any and everybody. USC has made a living with its defensive line getting after the passer. It has allowed them to sit the other 7 guys back in a zone and play the numbers game. Now it appears like we are going to have to send extra people which leads to trouble if you don't get to the QB. The field opens up and exposes those inexperienced Corners.

Its great to have a bunch of bodies, but we don't have any producers or anyone that has shown signs of being able to get after the QB. English is really all we have and its a wait and see with him.

The Dixons and Surratt have been solid but nothing spectacular. You need guys like them but they aren't going to make a game changing play.

Dukes, Griffin, and Harris haven't done anything of note in their playing time.

Cooper is transitioning from Linebacker and hasn't been able to stay healthy.

Green has been battling injuries since he has gotten here and Washington has been battling concussions.

Johnson and Lamin are unknowns. It seems like they are a talented pair, but we gotta see some results this Fall.

Blake McClain is probably out for the year.

Thomas and Wideman are bordering unlikely to qualify. Its pretty much a win that Wideman is likely going to be able to go to FUMA.

Sawyer and Ritchie are at a JUCO.

Looking back on it, I think our staff did a poor job with Defensive End recruiting but are making it up with this current class. Whammy just needs to bridge the gap until the reinforcements get here.
I have said a few times that I feel similarly to the way you do, with a caveat. Our pressure is going to need to come from the interior linemen or LB/safety blitzes as opposed to the defensive end pressure we've seen for so long. But there were times our DE's lost outside containment on the edge because they were so sack focused. Clowney @ Georgia last year as a prime example. I really believe if our ends can hold the edges and slip their blocks to tackle at the right time we can have a very effective defense that will just look different than in years past.

I would expect us to give up more big plays overall, and our opponents to have more time of possession. Our offense needs to really avoid the 3 and outs or it can snowball.
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Old 06-14-2014, 10:48 AM   #40
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Default Re: D-line Progress

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I have said a few times that I feel similarly to the way you do, with a caveat. Our pressure is going to need to come from the interior linemen or LB/safety blitzes as opposed to the defensive end pressure we've seen for so long. But there were times our DE's lost outside containment on the edge because they were so sack focused. Clowney @ Georgia last year as a prime example. I really believe if our ends can hold the edges and slip their blocks to tackle at the right time we can have a very effective defense that will just look different than in years past.

I would expect us to give up more big plays overall, and our opponents to have more time of possession. Our offense needs to really avoid the 3 and outs or it can snowball.
Because we are a no-name defense in 2014 panic is ensuing among the faithful. We mustn't forget we have good overall talent and size in great quantity. Games played on hot Saturdays last 4 long quarters. While other teams wither and die we can continue to rotate while maintaining strength.
It's going to be very tough going offensively for most teams to play a defense that can cycle in 30 players during 4 quarters. A conveyor belt of no-nams run by Whammy; If you will. This focus on the individual is not the proper viewpoint from which to judge our likely success on defense.
Take off your high powered Clowney glasses and put on your wide focus no-name glasses. Keep a roster beside you at all times so you can keep up with the Whammy conveyor belt
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