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Old 06-26-2017, 12:07 AM   #1
Three and Out
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Default We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

http://www.espn.com/video/clip?id=19729113

"We do our own ratings and have never used star ratings before."

I had never see this......great video with Chandler Farrell.
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Old 06-26-2017, 12:34 AM   #2
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

Nice video and words by both Chandler and Will.

It is unique to see a head coach sit down and talk at length about walk ons that will likely not see many game reps.

I guess his own experience as a walk on who earned playing time is a big part of how he treats those players
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Muschamp said he doesn't have a 3 year or 5 year plan, his plan is to win now and decisions will be based on winning now.

Muschamp believes that recruiting within a five-hour radius of USC, "we can recruit good enough players to win the East every year."
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Old 06-26-2017, 02:51 AM   #3
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

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Originally Posted by GregoryHouse View Post
Nice video and words by both Chandler and Will.

It is unique to see a head coach sit down and talk at length about walk ons that will likely not see many game reps.

I guess his own experience as a walk on who earned playing time is a big part of how he treats those players
exactly
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Old 06-26-2017, 04:45 AM   #4
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

dedication and determination are qualities you want on your team.
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Old 06-26-2017, 05:32 AM   #5
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

Alabama and a few other teams must use the star system because they have a ton of 4 star guys..even a couple 5 stars a year..it just so happens that those teams are at the top of cfb..

I know we support our coach but having a roster full of 3 star guys normally doesn't get you too far..here's to breaking the trend.
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Old 06-26-2017, 06:57 AM   #6
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

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Alabama and a few other teams must use the star system because they have a ton of 4 star guys..even a couple 5 stars a year..it just so happens that those teams are at the top of cfb..

I know we support our coach but having a roster full of 3 star guys normally doesn't get you too far..here's to breaking the trend.
There are instances where kids who are 3 stars suddenly get upgraded to 4 and 5 stars simply because Alabama and those "few other teams" are recruiting them.

Not saying that I wouldn't take more 4 or 5 star players in Columbia, just recognize that those assessments are imperfect and are absolutely no guarantee of future success. Just as a reminder - http://www.cbssports.com/college-foo...hool-recruits/
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Old 06-26-2017, 07:31 AM   #7
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

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Old 06-26-2017, 07:33 AM   #8
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

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Originally Posted by cocknblue View Post
There are instances where kids who are 3 stars suddenly get upgraded to 4 and 5 stars simply because Alabama and those "few other teams" are recruiting them.

Not saying that I wouldn't take more 4 or 5 star players in Columbia, just recognize that those assessments are imperfect and are absolutely no guarantee of future success. Just as a reminder - http://www.cbssports.com/college-foo...hool-recruits/
Maybe it's just me but I'd rather have a 5 star guy who was part of a NC team and then bombed in the NFL than a guy who was okay in college and then goes on to NFL success.
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Old 06-26-2017, 07:52 AM   #9
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

There are examples of 3 star guys who became great college and pro players. There are examples of 4 and 5 star guys who bombed out. We've had a few of both at SC. But for the most part the rating services are correct. Because we are SC we will have to build a team on the former.
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Old 06-26-2017, 07:56 AM   #10
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

The guys that play well on the field get the attention of the media, the recruiting services and the coaching staffs. So for the most part, the guys that we are recruiting are also the higher rated guys according to rating services.

The exceptions are the guys that don't get a lot of media attention (like O Linemen), or guys that don't get promoted by their schools, or that don't go to the summer camps, or that are in recruiting purgatory (areas that do not get a lot of attention from the media and recruiting services, like Western NC and pretty much most of SC). I think those guys are the ones that Boom is talking about - we will take them if they are evaluated by our staff and they can play.

Rico Dowdle is a case in point - a recruit from Western NC that did not get much love from the media or recruiting services (3*).

Farrell is an example of getting a potential starter to walk on.

Boom is doing a great job of getting some under the radar guys and improving the top to bottom talent on the team.
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Old 06-26-2017, 07:56 AM   #11
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

Muschamp understands we are not Alabama and are not going to consistently get the top players in the country. The only way this team gets anywhere is with a workman, blue collar type mentality and that is what he is building. A little success will bring more of the higher ranked guys into the system. Right now his staff is working to get some top guys, but are having to use their eyes as much as anything else to find the talent they need.

I hope Farrell becomes a good player for us. His father played for us and is now the principle of Summerville HS, which turns out some players that would fit our program well each year.
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Old 06-26-2017, 08:39 AM   #12
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

Keep in mind that some of these highly rated players love the recruiting process and all the attention that it brings. They dont love football. That is why relying on star rating can kill you. It doesnt tell you what his mental make up is.

Once the recruiting process is over and they are on campus, the work ethic goes down. Certainly not true of all highly rated players, but we have seen our share.

Seeing them in person, on campus, working against other recruits is by far the best way to evaluate talent.
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Old 06-26-2017, 09:17 AM   #13
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

People are making too much of this, and I'll never understand why people are either 'it's about the rankings' or 'rankings don't matter'.

The facts are, by the vast majority, really good football players get higher rankings and statistically have a higher chance of success. The stars, again for the most part, result from stats and camps and offer lists. So, yeah, it's a safe bet that if a recruit has offers from Bama and LSU and Florida and Ohio State they'll be ranked higher, and may get a 'bump' in the rankings, because those are really good programs that feel like the kid deserves a scholarship. But take away those stars, I would still love to win recruiting battles consistently with those teams instead of NC State or Western Carolina or Kentucky.

And if a coach recruits based on stars alone, it won't work out. Ask Miami. The reason Bama and FSU and Clemson now are so good is because they recruit the stars but also had a focus on the non-skill positions. It's also the reason that Freeze could cheat like a MF and still fail.

Finally, don't delude yourselves. Muschamp would trade our roster with Bama or Clemson or FSU in a second. Maybe there would be some kids who 'don't fit system', but sometimes, as in all areas of life, natural talent supersedes work ethic or attitude. I think Cam Newton was the biggest d-bag in the history of college athletics, and I would trade him for every single starting QB we've had a USC save one.
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Old 06-26-2017, 09:23 AM   #14
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

Wasn't there a study of the current players in the NFL. The majority of them were 2 and 3 star players. That simply says there is NO WAY of determining a recruits success in college or NFL. Stars are essentially recruiting services evaluation. WM just seems to trust his own evaluations. I'm that way in my job too. If it's my job, I'm evaluating the people myself for what I'm trying to do
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Old 06-26-2017, 09:38 AM   #15
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

id imagine not many coaches have a subscription to any of the recruiting sites. hes not saying since we cant get the rivals top rated player at every position we have to look at game film ourselves, hes saying he and his staff do their own evaluations no matter what, now at usc or in the past at florida. im not poo pooing those sites, but they dont all agree with each other, and one would hope a coaching staff would be more concerned with looking at the film themselves, seeing the player workout in person, and knowing what kind of person he is, etc.

if a staff is incapable or too lazy to evaluate on their own, theyre doomed.
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Old 06-26-2017, 09:41 AM   #16
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

I'm sure most of you have noted that after Muschamp offers, other schools follow soon thereafter. Yes, he's offered plenty of 3* guys, but there's a bunch of 4-5* guys too. In fact, many of the players expected to announce this summer are 4*. Part of what the video is trying to show is that Muschamp also is looking for 100% effort and determination players, just like himself at Georgia.
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Old 06-26-2017, 09:53 AM   #17
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

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Wasn't there a study of the current players in the NFL. The majority of them were 2 and 3 star players. That simply says there is NO WAY of determining a recruits success in college or NFL. Stars are essentially recruiting services evaluation. WM just seems to trust his own evaluations. I'm that way in my job too. If it's my job, I'm evaluating the people myself for what I'm trying to do
I think the most important thing for us to look at is the fact that the last few NCAA champions, with the exception of Clemson, have all finished in the top 10 recruiting almost every year. When was the last time a school that fell outside the top 20 in recruiting multiple years won a National Championship?

Alabama
Ohio State
Florida State
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Old 06-26-2017, 10:00 AM   #18
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

"We don't use star ratings. We use our own evaluations."

"You don't treat him (the walkon) any different than you treat the 5 star guy...."
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Old 06-26-2017, 10:08 AM   #19
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

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"We don't use star ratings. We use our own evaluations."

"You don't treat him (the walkon) any different than you treat the 5 star guy...."
Not trying to single you out, but this is coach speak. You'll never hear someone admitting the opposite, but you'll see it time and again in action.

For example, do you really think the results of a walk-on QB dialing it in for a practice would be the same as Bentley? Or if a walk-on WR dropped four balls in practice versus Deebo?

Muschamp brings a workman mentality, which I really like, but let's try not to get enamored by coach talk in the off-season.


And as far as stars and the NFL, numbers aren't important. You'll have to look at percent success--i.e. making a NFL roster.
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Old 06-26-2017, 10:22 AM   #20
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Default Re: We Don't Use Star Ratings - Will Muschamp

We'll still offer 4 and 5 star players. He's just saying that he knows what he wants for his team and will go after it whether that player is a 3,4 or 5 star player. Not to mention the guys he's offered tend to get bumped up in the ratings once he's offered them.
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